Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder2.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Catrike Ryder Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech Subject: Re: 1972 Legnano in the news Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2024 07:38:18 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 201 Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2024 13:38:22 +0100 (CET) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="4caccf24ef0d591630bbadef60de8fd7"; logging-data="2963437"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX191zIhIiQ9Zn/jkr5HrAku4aZs6fRaYNX0=" User-Agent: ForteAgent/8.00.32.1272 Cancel-Lock: sha1:ePO3RUWuIu/0pX44kjgeEx1JLkw= Bytes: 9436 On Thu, 14 Nov 2024 07:15:49 -0500, Zen Cycle wrote: >On 11/13/2024 5:35 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote: >> On Wed, 13 Nov 2024 16:31:50 -0500, Zen Cycle >> wrote: >> >>> On 11/13/2024 4:19 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote: >>>> On Wed, 13 Nov 2024 15:57:24 -0500, Zen Cycle >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> On 11/13/2024 3:23 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote: >>>>>> On Wed, 13 Nov 2024 15:01:19 -0500, Frank Krygowski >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On 11/13/2024 2:07 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote: >>>>>>>> On Wed, 13 Nov 2024 13:52:27 -0500, Frank Krygowski >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 11/13/2024 11:11 AM, Zen Cycle wrote: >>>>>>>>>> On 11/13/2024 10:35 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 13 Nov 2024 10:13:52 -0500, Frank Krygowski >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/13/2024 4:27 AM, John B. wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 13 Nov 2024 03:35:27 -0500, Catrike Ryder >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 12 Nov 2024 21:29:58 -0500, Frank Krygowski >>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/12/2024 4:44 PM, Radey Shouman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I just did a web search for "walking helmet", and got pages of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stuff on >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> helmets for babies and toddlers learning to walk.  I guess that's a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thing these days; I must be out of touch.  Perhaps one day we'll >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> see a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> generation unwilling to step outside without a helmet. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That'll be a sad day indeed. But the general trend toward "Danger! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Danger!" warnings is strong. At one time, Safe Kids recommended >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that no >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> kid under age 10 be allowed to cross a street alone. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And there's this: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.learnbydestroying.com/jeffl/crud/Bicycle-Safety.jpg >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Thanks, Jeff.) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I understand that some fear mongers actually want to ban bidirectional >>>>>>>>>>>>>> side paths. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Didn't Frank argue that ALL bike lanes were dangerious. Or rather more >>>>>>>>>>>>> dangerious then the road? >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> No, I did not argue that. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> And John, much like Tom, you need to rely much less on your "memory" and >>>>>>>>>>>> much more on actual quotes of what I've said. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Quit emulating Tom. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> "Surprisingly, bike trails can be more dangerous than roads." >>>>>>>>>>> "[-] you're more likely go to the emergency room from riding a mile on >>>>>>>>>>> the bike trail than from riding a mile on the roads!" >>>>>>>>>>> --Frank Krygowski >>>>>>>>>>> https://bicyclinglife.com/SafetySkills/FrankNFred014.htm >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> which is not "ALL bike lanes were dangerous. Or rather [ALL bike lanes >>>>>>>>>> are] more dangerous then the road?" >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> spelling corrected and context clarified. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> floriduh dumbassess 4th grade reading comprehension on display again >>>>>>>>> I wonder if those two guys really think their obvious distortions of my >>>>>>>>> positions are convincing anybody. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I quoted your exact words and provided documentation. How is that a >>>>>>>> distortion? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Here it is again.... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> "Surprisingly, bike trails can be more dangerous than roads." >>>>>>>> "[-] you're more likely go to the emergency room from riding a mile on >>>>>>>> the bike trail than from riding a mile on the roads!" >>>>>>>> --Frank Krygowski >>>>>>>> https://bicyclinglife.com/SafetySkills/FrankNFred014.htm >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This guy is baffled by the distinction between "ALL are" and "can be." >>>>>> >>>>>> No baffling involved. I simply quoted the incorrect, nonsense that you >>>>>> wrote. >>>>> >>>>> and conflated "all are" with "can be" in the process. >>>>> If you know you did it, you're a liar. >>>>> If you didn't know you did it, you're ignorant. >>>>> >>>>> So, are you ignorant? or a liar? >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> And for some data, see Transportation Research Record 1636 Paper No. >>>>>>> 98-0009, "Adult Bicyclists in the United States" by William E. Moritz >>>>>>> >>>>>>> His research paper referenced three different surveys of bike users, the >>>>>>> earliest of League of American Wheelmen members in 1974, one of about a >>>>>>> thousand Washington State adults in 1994, and one of League of American >>>>>>> Bicyclists members in 1996. Here are the resulting crash rates (per >>>>>>> million km) by facility. The numbers are in chronological order, so LAW >>>>>>> first, WA second, LAB third: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Major road with no facilities: 71, 69, 41 >>>>>>> Minor road with no facilities: 65, 82, 59 >>>>>>> Multiuse trail: 181, 91, 88. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> All three surveys found multiuse trails to be much more dangerous than >>>>>>> ordinary streets and roads, per kilometer (or mile) traveled. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> And as I've mentioned here before, I'm seeing the same thing with >>>>>>> reports of crashes among out club riders, even though only a small >>>>>>> portion of our rides use such trails. >>>>>> >>>>>> Didn't you admit that you used them? >>>>>> >>>>>>> BTW, the last such crash was less than two weeks ago. The guy in >>>>>>> question moved to the center of the trail to avoid a thick coating of >>>>>>> leaves. But in the center were some chunks of broken tree branches, over >>>>>>> an inch thick. He hit those and went down, breaking several ribs. >>>>>> >>>>>> Another undocumented anecdote..... >>>>>> >>>>>>> That's very rare on the road. If you ride where car tires pass, the >>>>>>> pavement stays quite clean. >>>>>> >>>>>> Those studies don't mention what types of cyclists were involved. >>>>>> >>>>>> Given that a far higher percentage of cyclists on MUPs would likely be >>>>>> inexperienced, elderly, and/or children, the results of studies are >>>>>> worthless. >>>>> >>>>> Not nearly as worthless as you opinion. >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> C'est bon >>>>>> Soloman >>>> >>>> Truth is, Junior, I never mentioned the words, "all are." I simply >>>> quoted Krygowski's nonsense. >>> >>> The truth is, dumbass, you copy pasted Franks message from your "Frank >>> File"* in support of Johns claim that Frank said "All", conflating "all >>> are" with "can be" in the process. >> >> I did no such thing. I simply posted something related to it. > >Unlike you, we have reading comprehension beyond the 4th grade. Your >intention was to conflate it 'all are' with 'can be'. > >> >>> If you know you did it, you're a liar. >>> If you didn't know you did it, you're ignorant. >>> >>> So, are you ignorant? or a liar? >> >> Wow, Junior. What are you so angry about? > >Got it, you're both. > >> >>> * You still don't get how revealing of your (lack of) character and >>> hypocrisy it is to keep a "frank file" with all his messages for easy >>> access. >> >> Those Krygowski quotes above came directly from the website he and his >> friends made. >> https://bicyclinglife.com/ > >gee, that's not obsessive at all. ========== REMAINDER OF ARTICLE TRUNCATED ==========