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Path: ...!news.mixmin.net!news2.arglkargh.de!news.karotte.org!news.szaf.org!nntp-feed.chiark.greenend.org.uk!ewrotcd!news.eyrie.org!beagle.ediacara.org!.POSTED.beagle.ediacara.org!not-for-mail From: RonO <rokimoto@cox.net> Newsgroups: talk.origins Subject: Re: A cyanobacteria may be evolving organelle like characteristics Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2024 19:03:11 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 45 Sender: to%beagle.ediacara.org Approved: moderator@beagle.ediacara.org Message-ID: <uvci40$2kiaa$1@dont-email.me> References: <uvac88$25lh1$1@dont-email.me> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: beagle.ediacara.org; posting-host="beagle.ediacara.org:3.132.105.89"; logging-data="11272"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@beagle.ediacara.org" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird To: talk-origins@moderators.isc.org Cancel-Lock: sha1:Dc+2oTqAWRt0RbmPsb6BskGKdZ0= Return-Path: <news@eternal-september.org> X-Original-To: talk-origins@ediacara.org Delivered-To: talk-origins@ediacara.org id CEF9A22976C; Fri, 12 Apr 2024 20:03:04 -0400 (EDT) by beagle.ediacara.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9BEE229758 for <talk-origins@ediacara.org>; Fri, 12 Apr 2024 20:03:02 -0400 (EDT) id 41A5F7D12B; Sat, 13 Apr 2024 00:03:14 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: talk-origins@moderators.isc.org by mod-relay.zaccari.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 192787D129 for <talk-origins@moderators.isc.org>; Sat, 13 Apr 2024 00:03:14 +0000 (UTC) id C9432DC01A9; Sat, 13 Apr 2024 02:03:12 +0200 (CEST) X-Injection-Date: Sat, 13 Apr 2024 02:03:12 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: <uvac88$25lh1$1@dont-email.me> Content-Language: en-US X-Auth-Sender: U2FsdGVkX1+/VAEK9ZCjTf10fw18SuRagt2Lv/1P2AI= Bytes: 3740 On 4/11/2024 11:10 PM, Pro Plyd wrote: > > https://www.uri.edu/news/2024/04/evolution-in-action-new-study-finds-possibility-of-nitrogen-fixing-organelles/ > > Nitrogen is a nutrient essential for all life > on Earth. Although nitrogen gas (N2) is > plentiful, it is largely unavailable to most > organisms without a process known as nitrogen > fixation, which converts dinitrogen to > ammonium — a major inorganic nitrogen source. > > While there are bacteria that are able to > reduce dinitrogen to ammonium, researchers at > the University of Rhode Island, Institut de > Ciències del Mar in Barcelona, University of > California at Santa Cruz and the Massachusetts > Institute of Technology have discovered > nitrogen-fixing symbiotic organisms exhibiting > behaviors similar to organelles. In fact, > researchers posit these symbiotic organisms – > UCYN-A, a species of cyanobacteria – may be > evolving organelle-like characteristics. > ... > > paper here > > https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S009286742400182X > Metabolic trade-offs constrain the cell size > ratio in a nitrogen-fixing symbiosis > My take is that nitrogen fixers are usually anaerobic. This one likely isn't very efficient at nitrogen fixing, and it gave up on photosynthesis and can't use light to fix carbon so it needs help in order to maintain it's nitrogen fixing ability. Some how it needs to sequester itself away from oxygen inside an aerobic host. Legumes help their nitrogen fixers by having leghemoglobin to sop up oxygen and keep the levels low enough in the root nodules so that their nitrogen fixing bacteria can fix nitrogen for them. In return the plants give the bacteria a carbon source. Sequestering from oxygen inside of an aerobic cell has to be difficult and is likely the reason that such an endosymbiosis has not occurred. Ron Okimoto