Path: ...!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Janis Papanagnou Newsgroups: comp.lang.c Subject: Re: Top 10 most common hard skills listed on resumes... Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2024 19:02:55 +0200 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 63 Message-ID: References: <875xrkxlgo.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <87o75bwlp8.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <871q27weeh.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <20240829083200.195@kylheku.com> <87v7zjuyd8.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <20240829084851.962@kylheku.com> <87mskvuxe9.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <875xrivrg0.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <20240829191404.887@kylheku.com> <86cylqw2f8.fsf@linuxsc.com> <871q2568vl.fsf@nosuchdomain.example.com> <87cylo494u.fsf@nosuchdomain.example.com> <20240831195350.785@kylheku.com> <86mskrrvco.fsf@linuxsc.com> <86sety9yd6.fsf@linuxsc.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2024 19:02:56 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="3ff418363c2f95269617ae7ad02c98f4"; logging-data="3806710"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX198Nk0yekEavnfkfJK6XW8q" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 Cancel-Lock: sha1:mj/WaSGJdHtS6jQpckvP9WFQ6yY= X-Enigmail-Draft-Status: N1110 In-Reply-To: <86sety9yd6.fsf@linuxsc.com> Bytes: 4252 On 17.09.2024 15:57, Tim Rentsch wrote: > Janis Papanagnou writes: > >> On 01.09.2024 22:07, Tim Rentsch wrote: >> >>> [...] The most important purpose of >>> the ISO C standard is to be read and understood by ordinary C >>> developers, not just compiler writers. [...] >> >> Is that part of a preamble or rationale given in the C standard? >> >> That target audience would surely surprise me. Myself I've >> programmed in quite some programming languages and never read a >> standard document of the respective language, nor did I yet met >> any programmer who have done so. All programmer folks I know used >> text books to learn and look up things and specific documentation >> that comes with the compiler or interpreter products. (This is of >> course just a personal experience.) >> >> I've also worked a lot with standards documents in various areas >> (mainly ISO and ITU-T standards but also some others). [..] > > My comment is only about the C standard, not any other standards > documents. Yes, that was obvious. Are trying to say that the "C standard" is substantially different with respect to "readability" to other standards? - In the context of what has been said, that it's a replacement of a textbook (or at least maybe a supplement)? - Obviously you seem to agree that it's not, since elsethread you say "The C standard is a reference, not a tutorial." and I agree with that; since that was actually what I expressed (or at least tried to express; sorry, if that was unclear to you). >> [...] > >> I mean, what will a programmer get from the "C" standard that a >> well written text book doesn't provide? > > The text books being imagined here don't exist, because there is no > market for them. I'm speaking about existing textbooks for programming languages. (Not sure what you're reading or implying here.) > Very few developers read the C standard. Yes, that was also my impression. (And I'm sure to know the reason; standards are not suited for, not written for general programmers. they, IMO obviously, have another target group.) > But the > impact and influence of those who do is much larger than the small > numbers would suggest. What influence? (I wasn't speaking about any influence or reach. I was just speaking about the target reader-audience of standards, and about the role of standards and textbooks for programmers.) Janis