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From: RonO <rokimoto557@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: talk.origins
Subject: Re: California dairy workers infected by H5N1
Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2024 11:51:07 -0500
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On 10/12/2024 5:25 PM, RonO wrote:
> On 10/10/2024 6:37 PM, RonO wrote:
>> On 10/8/2024 8:38 PM, RonO wrote:
>>> On 10/8/2024 2:34 PM, RonO wrote:
>>>> On 10/6/2024 12:28 PM, RonO wrote:
>>>>> On 10/4/2024 11:39 AM, RonO wrote:
>>>>>> On 10/4/2024 10:41 AM, RonO wrote:
>>>>>>> On 10/4/2024 8:25 AM, RonO wrote:
>>>>>>>> https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/california-dairy-workers- 
>>>>>>>> infected- bird-flu-latest-human-114482799
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Two California dairy workers have been confirmed to have been 
>>>>>>>> infected by the H5N1 dairy virus.  Both were dairy workers.  It 
>>>>>>>> was expected because California has had the highest herd 
>>>>>>>> detection rate because they have been tracking dairy worker 
>>>>>>>> contacts from infected herds, and have been identifying infected 
>>>>>>>> herds before the dairy farmers had detected symptoms.  It has 
>>>>>>>> been likely that dairy workers were spreading the virus to 
>>>>>>>> poultry farms since the beginnings in Texas. The virus only is 
>>>>>>>> infectious off clothing or skin for less than 30 minutes, and 
>>>>>>>> they knew that poultry farms and states like Kansas did not get 
>>>>>>>> infected cattle. Infected dairy workers have likely been 
>>>>>>>> spreading the virus from the beginning.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> California was not testing the dairy workers, they were only 
>>>>>>>> tracking their contacts.  These two had the eye infection 
>>>>>>>> symptoms, and were tested.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The CDC is still claiming the danger of human to human infection 
>>>>>>>> is low, but the more herds infected the more humans will be 
>>>>>>>> infected, and the greater the chance that the virus will mutate 
>>>>>>>> into something much worse.   They are claiming that this isn't 
>>>>>>>> evidence for person to person transmission, but that isn't the 
>>>>>>>> major issue with infected herds.  It is the virus evolving to 
>>>>>>>> better infect humans that is the issue that they should be 
>>>>>>>> trying to control, and the CDC refuses to do anything about that.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> California is trying to detect all the infected herds as quickly 
>>>>>>>> as possible, and they are using possible human transmission to 
>>>>>>>> other farms to do it, and it is obviously working.  Over 50 
>>>>>>>> herds have been detected nearly all in the last couple weeks.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ron Okimoto
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Asian strain of H5N1 killed dozens of big cats at two zoos in 
>>>>>>> Vietnam.  47 tigers, 3 lions and 1 panther died.  The dairy H5N1 
>>>>>>> is a recombinant virus and half of it's genome is from a North 
>>>>>>> American strain of Avian influenza, but it still is lethal to 
>>>>>>> cats.  In the US the cats have been dying of brain infections.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/dozens-zoo-tigers-die- 
>>>>>>> after- contracting-bird-flu-114490246
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ron Okimoto
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2024/s1003-birdflu-case- 
>>>>>> california.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The CDC is still claiming that human infections are rare, but that 
>>>>>> likely was never the case.  The CDC still has tested less than 250 
>>>>>> people when thousands have been in contact with infected cattle or 
>>>>>> close contacts of dairy workers.  My take is that the spread from 
>>>>>> herd to herd and poultry farms can be explained by an infection 
>>>>>> rate of around than 5% among dairy workers, but the Colorado 
>>>>>> poultry workers (6 of them) were infected at the same farm dealing 
>>>>>> with the dairy virus infecting a layer flock.  These poultry 
>>>>>> workers were wearing protective gear, but it wasn't enough.  The 
>>>>>> dairy virus seems to infect the patients eyes, so you pretty much 
>>>>>> need to wear a gas mask like face protector to keep from getting 
>>>>>> infected.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As stupid as it may be the CDC is still advising people to wear 
>>>>>> protective equipment when dealing with infected animals, but they 
>>>>>> refuse to identify all the infected herds so that the people will 
>>>>>> know when they should wear the protective gear.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The CDC is really supporting their failing program, and refuse to 
>>>>>> admit that they have been wrong for months.  They never started 
>>>>>> contact tracing, and testing dairy workers.  They never attempted 
>>>>>> to identify all the infected herds even though their advice to 
>>>>>> dairy workers about wearing protective gear depended on 
>>>>>> identifying infected herds. California has demonstrated that 
>>>>>> contact tracing works in detecting infected herds even if the 
>>>>>> dairy workers are not tested. They have known that more states had 
>>>>>> infected herds, but refused to start testing in those states.  It 
>>>>>> has been obvious since May that Florida had infected herds.  
>>>>>> Positive dairy products were produced in Florida (FDA testing) 
>>>>>> even though Florida is several states away from Carolina and Texas 
>>>>>> (states known to have infected herds) and the CDC's own waste 
>>>>>> water data indicated that some Florida counties had exceptionally 
>>>>>> high levels of influenza in their waste water.  No one went to 
>>>>>> those counties to test the dairies, nor track back the milk source 
>>>>>> of the positive dairy plant that produced the positive dairy 
>>>>>> products.  Dairy workers have been exposed to the virus in 
>>>>>> Florida, at least, since May and they are not testing, nor are 
>>>>>> they requiring protective gear to protect the dairy workers from 
>>>>>> being infected. Florida is just one of the states that has not 
>>>>>> admitted to having infected herds at this time.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ron Okimoto
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> https://abcnews.go.com/Health/us-72m-vaccine-manufacturers-advance- 
>>>>> bird- flu-shot/story?id=114502971
>>>>>
>>>>> The US is putting 72 million into getting pharm companies started 
>>>>> in producing a flu vaccine that includes H5.  The latest Missouri 
>>>>> case indicates that this is wasted money.  That patient had an H5 
>>>>> gene with 2 amino acid substitutions in it that supposedly reduces 
>>>>> neutralizing ability of H5 antigens 10 to 100 fold.  The CDC is 
>>>>> currently allowing the virus to spread among dairy cattle and dairy 
>>>>> workers, and the virus is obviously mutating.  What we will need is 
>>>>> a vaccine that works against the version of the virus that 
>>>>> eventually adapts to better infect humans.
>>>>>
>>>>> They should have been identifying all the infected herds and trying 
>>>>> to limit the spread of the virus from the beginning.  California 
>>>>> indicates that contact tracing dairy workers even without testing 
>>>>> them can identify infected herds, but the CDC never started contact 
>>>>> tracing, nor a testing program for dairy workers.  Infected dairy 
>>>>> workers have likely been the primary vector for spreading the dairy 
>>>>> virus to other herds and poultry farms.  As the virus spread it 
>>>>> mutates, so any attempt to make a vaccine at this time will likely 
>>>>> fall short of making an effective vaccine against what will 
>>>>> eventually become the next pandemic virus.
>>>>>
>>>>> Really, only two herds in Michigan got infected cattle from Texas, 
>>>>> and it was likely spread to multiple counties and dozens of herds 
>>>>> by dairy workers.  The Michigan survey of dairy workers told them 
>>>>> that it was common for dairy workers to work at more than one dairy 
>>>>> farm, and some of them worked at poultry farms.  Michigan lost 
>>>>> several very large flocks of layers to the dairy virus, and dairy 
>>>>> workers likely infected the first flock while the other flocks 
>>>>> shared poultry workers.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ron Okimoto
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Second attempt to send:
>>>>
>>>> https://www.cnn.com/2024/10/08/health/bird-flu-california-dairy- 
>>>> farms/ index.html
>>>>
>>>> A third dairy worker in California is believed to have been infected 
>>>> by the dairy virus.  The CDC is obfuscating the issue instead of 
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