Path: ...!newsreader4.netcologne.de!news.netcologne.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail From: Rambo Newsgroups: uk.net.news.moderation,uk.radio.amateur Subject: Re: Complaint: Nasty behaviour masquerading as "moderation". Date: Fri, 01 Apr 2022 12:44:58 +0100 Lines: 158 Message-ID: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: individual.net Qwioij5jmjlu/etobClosw2TmAAHmzTrEx5mLD0UPSsG5OdpWT Cancel-Lock: sha1:kDRckyAK7LF54C+qwuv0Kp5IlpQ= User-Agent: ForteAgent/8.00.32.1272 Bytes: 8544 On Fri, 01 Apr 2022 12:39:44 +0100, Pamela wrote: >On 07:10 1 Apr 2022, Jim Stewart ... said: > >> On 31/03/2022 20:56, Bernie wrote: >>> On Thu, 31 Mar 2022 14:37:01 +0100 >>> Pamela wrote: >>> >>>> On 13:29 31 Mar 2022, Bernie said: >>>>> On Thu, 31 Mar 2022 13:06:36 +0100 "Jim Stewart ..." >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> On 31/03/2022 11:09, Bernie wrote: >>>>>>> On Wed, 30 Mar 2022 23:16:05 +0100 Rambo >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> On Wed, 30 Mar 2022 22:28:32 +0100, Pamela >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> On 22:07 30 Mar 2022, Rambo said: >>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2022 19:52:51 +0100, Pamela >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> On 19:34 29 Mar 2022, Brian said: >>>>>>>>>>>> Norman Wells wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 29/03/2022 17:44, Roland Perry wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> In message , at >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 17:11:44 on Tue, 29 Mar 2022, Norman Wells >>>>>>>>>>>>>> remarked: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 29/03/2022 11:22, Roland Perry wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In message , at >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 10:34:29 on Tue, 29 Mar 2022, Norman Wells >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> remarked: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 29/03/2022 10:03, Roland Perry wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In message , at >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22:22:15 on Mon, 28  Mar 2022, Norman Wells >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> remarked: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 28/03/2022 18:54, Roland Perry wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In message , at >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 17:01:15 on Mon, 28 Mar  2022, Algernon >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Goss-Custard remarked: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mark Goodge >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> posted >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All the moderators are, presumably, on the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> whitelist. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What is the justification for this rule, if rule >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it is? It seems to  me  that much of Jeff and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Norm complaints could be addressed by  getting >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rid of it. Roland's diversionary argument against >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a ban on moderators moderating their own posts >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because "trigger words" would then be irrelevant. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  It's by far the most commonplace circumstance >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> where >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> moderators accept  their own posts. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The most common occurrence actually is moderators >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> posting off-topic  with no restraint, no control, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no action and no comment. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  That's untrue, as a simple matter of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fact/history. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> They'd have to include their own trigger word in such >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> postings, and that's quite unlikely. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What I'm saying is they mark their own homework, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  The modbot is marking the homework! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As far as I understand the procedure, it doesn't; it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> merely flags it for manual marking. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> That's only if a trigger word has been used. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and don't even seem to consider whether what they're >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> posting is not new or off-topic.  There's no-one to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stop them, so that's what happens. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  I thought you were all in favour of free-ranging >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> discussions, that people seem to be interested in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> participating in. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am.  But only if it applies to all equally. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> It applies equally to all those who don't use trigger >>>>>>>>>>>>>> words, or have been white-listed. Achieving the latter is >>>>>>>>>>>>>> simply case of not failing to be charming enough. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> You seem utterly hung up on trigger words, and won't >>>>>>>>>>>>> consider off-topic posts that don't contain them. There >>>>>>>>>>>>> the modbot is not involved at all, so whitelisters can do >>>>>>>>>>>>> what they like with impunity. And experience shows that >>>>>>>>>>>>> they do. Whitelisters and moderators mark their own >>>>>>>>>>>>> homework and surprise, surprise, they always pass. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Roland uses things irrelevant things to try and cause >>>>>>>>>>>> confusion / divert attention. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I moderate several groups, none of which use an automated >>>>>>>>>>>> trigger word system. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Brian, is your contribution effective and well-received in >>>>>>>>>>> those groups? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> "uk.radio.amateur.moderated" has only 50 posts since the >>>>>>>>>>> beginning of December and is almost dead. You made only one >>>>>>>>>>> post in that time. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Can you identify your groups? Maybe someone else knows and >>>>>>>>>>> can help name them. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> RSGBtech >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Is it an explemplary group which U.L.M. could learn from, as >>>>>>>>> Brian seems to be suggesting? Its web page says only the >>>>>>>>> following and there doesn't seem to be a separate moderation >>>>>>>>> policy. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Moderation aims to be "light touch"- avoid abuse and stay >>>>>>>>> on topic and you will not be "moderated". >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> https://groups.io/g/RSGBTechnical >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Anyone he doen't like is barred. It's his little empire. Don't >>>>>>>> bother. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hey, I'm not barred - I guess that means he likes me? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Well, that's cheered me up! >>>>>>> >>>>>> brian likes nobody...not even himself...I quite like him thoughh >>>>>> and I know he likes me a bit... >>>>> >>>>> It'd be nice if Reay and Evans could make up. It's a shame for >>>>> them to fall out forever just because Reay was a bit brusque when >>>>> correcting Evans's technical inadequacies. >>>> >>>> "Technical inadequacies"? According to the Gazette and Herald, >>>> Brian had been goading someone online for nine years: >>>> >>>> "brought as evidence 50 occasions where he said Mr Reay had >>>> been grossly offensive, which he believed was specifically >>>> targeting his Welsh wife" >>> >>> Yeah, sure. Subsequent to the initial technical drubbing, Reay did >>> some goading and Evans did some sea-lioning. But it was Evans's >>> technical ineptitude (in comparison to Reay) that drove the conflict >>> onwards. >> >> which ended up with a polis man killing himself for what he had done > >A policeman killing himself. Are you sure? > >For what Gareth or for what Brian had done? https://www.gazetteandherald.co.uk/news/2108017.wiltshire-policeman-dies/