Path: ...!3.eu.feeder.erje.net!feeder.erje.net!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott Newsgroups: comp.theory,sci.logic Subject: Re: Every D(D) simulated by H presents non-halting behavior to H Date: Tue, 7 May 2024 21:40:19 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 95 Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Wed, 08 May 2024 04:40:20 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="883a48edd812fc46b7908dfbe69f1e37"; logging-data="3910796"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX19QG6JHQ+AvKJSP2V3Db1s7" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:GzSXr94kcKNj4KLO+LUfOVvAxrw= Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: Bytes: 4873 On 5/7/2024 9:36 PM, Richard Damon wrote: > On 5/7/24 11:40 AM, olcott wrote: >> On 5/7/2024 6:18 AM, Richard Damon wrote: >>> On 5/7/24 3:30 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>> On 2024-05-06 18:28:37 +0000, olcott said: >>>> >>>>> On 5/6/2024 11:19 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>> On 2024-05-05 17:02:25 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>> >>>>>>> The x86utm operating system: https://github.com/plolcott/x86utm >>>>>>> enables >>>>>>> one C function to execute another C function in debug step mode. >>>>>>> Simulating Termination analyzer H simulates the x86 machine code >>>>>>> of its >>>>>>> input (using libx86emu) in debug step mode until it correctly >>>>>>> matches a >>>>>>> correct non-halting behavior pattern proving that its input will >>>>>>> never >>>>>>> stop running unless aborted. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Can D correctly simulated by H terminate normally? >>>>>>> 00 int H(ptr x, ptr x)  // ptr is pointer to int function >>>>>>> 01 int D(ptr x) >>>>>>> 02 { >>>>>>> 03   int Halt_Status = H(x, x); >>>>>>> 04   if (Halt_Status) >>>>>>> 05     HERE: goto HERE; >>>>>>> 06   return Halt_Status; >>>>>>> 07 } >>>>>>> 08 >>>>>>> 09 int main() >>>>>>> 10 { >>>>>>> 11   H(D,D); >>>>>>> 12 } >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *Execution Trace* >>>>>>> Line 11: main() invokes H(D,D); >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *keeps repeating* (unless aborted) >>>>>>> Line 03: simulated D(D) invokes simulated H(D,D) that simulates D(D) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *Simulation invariant* >>>>>>> D correctly simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own >>>>>>> line 03. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The above execution trace proves that (for every H/D pair of the >>>>>>> infinite set of H/D pairs) each D(D) simulated by the H that this >>>>>>> D(D) >>>>>>> calls cannot possibly reach past its own line 03. >>>>>> >>>>>> When you say "every H/D pair" you should specify which set of pairs >>>>>> you are talking about. As you don't, your words don't mean anything. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Every H/D pair in the universe where D(D) is simulated by the >>>>> same H(D,D) that D(D) calls. This involves 1 to ∞ steps of D >>>>> and also includes zero to ∞ recursive simulations where H >>>>> H simulates itself simulating D(D). >>>> >>>> "In the universe" is not a set. In typical set theories like ZFC there >>>> is no universal set. >>> >> >> This template defines an infinite set of finite string H/D pairs where >> each D(D) that is simulated by H(D,D) also calls this same H(D,D). >> >> These H/D pairs can be enumerated by the one to ∞ simulated steps of D >> and involve zero to ∞ recursive simulations of H simulating itself >> simulating D(D). Every time Lines 1,2,3 are simulated again defines >> one more level of recursive simulation. >> >> 1st element of H/D pairs 1 step  of D  is simulated by H >> 2nd element of H/D pairs 2 steps of D are simulated by H >> 3rd element of H/D pairs 3 steps of D are simulated by H >> >> 4th element of H/D pairs 4 steps of D are simulated by H >> this begins the first recursive simulation at line 01 >> >> 5th element of H/D pairs 5 steps of D are simulated by >> next step of the first recursive simulation at line 02 >> >> 6th element of H/D pairs 6 steps of D are simulated by >> last step of the first recursive simulation at line 03 >> >> 7th element of H/D pairs 7 steps of D are simulated by H >> this begins the second recursive simulation at line 01 > > Ok, and I can make an H that simulates its D to the final state. Liar -- Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer