Path: ...!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott Newsgroups: comp.theory,sci.logic Subject: Re: Refutation of the Peter Linz Halting Problem proof 2024-03-05 --closure yet?-- Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2024 10:23:42 -0600 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 86 Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2024 16:23:42 -0000 (UTC) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="cbe692f823dc8310f00dd0aaf1f84978"; logging-data="1876368"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/wIcaiCY4hwJ25hDQc2eKu" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:Fv+kPRw+4fNPPsGrLqvbDwej2Wg= Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: Bytes: 5006 On 3/8/2024 10:17 AM, immibis wrote: > On 8/03/24 03:16, olcott wrote: >> On 3/7/2024 7:37 PM, immibis wrote: >>> On 8/03/24 00:04, olcott wrote: >>>> On 3/7/2024 4:21 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>> On 3/7/24 12:20 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>> On 3/7/2024 1:59 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>>>> On 3/6/24 11:11 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>> On 3/7/2024 12:37 AM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>>>>>> On 3/6/24 10:17 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hq0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hqy ∞ // Ĥ applied to ⟨Ĥ⟩ halts >>>>>>>>>> Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hq0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hqn     // Ĥ applied to ⟨Ĥ⟩ >>>>>>>>>> does not halt >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The design of Olcott Machines makes quite easy for Ĥ.H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ >>>>>>>>>> to get its abort criteria. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Which doesn't match the Halting Problem requirements, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It does match the Halting Problem requirements, when >>>>>>>> they are implemented indirectly as "abort criteria". >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Which is a different criteria, so you are just admitting that you >>>>>>> are using a strawman desception and thus INTENTIONALLY LYING. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Somehow you think lies are ok if they help you prove your false >>>>>>> statements. >>>>>> >>>>>> The Linz second ⊢* enables H to compute any damn >>>>>> thing as long as this ends up computing halting. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Note quite, it is whatever the algorithm for H generates. >>>>> >>>>> That exact same algorithm exists in H^.H, so that WILL get the same >>>>> answer, and since you logic says it doesn't, that means you are >>>>> lying that H^ was built by the specification, or as to what H will >>>>> actually do. >>>> >>>> *Already addressed in my reply to you here* >>>> We finally know exactly how H1(D,D) derives a different result than >>>> H(D,D) >>>> >>> >>> We know it's because H and H1 are different programs, not copies. >> >> *Even when we remove the infinite loop appended to Ĥ.Hqy* >> Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hq0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hqy // Ĥ applied to ⟨Ĥ⟩ halts >> Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hq0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hqn // Ĥ applied to ⟨Ĥ⟩ does not halt >> >> An Olcott machine Ĥ.H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ <Ĥ> could trivially determine >> that it is calling itself in recursive simulation. >> >> and Olcott machine H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ could trivially determine >> that it is NOT calling itself in recursive simulation. >> >> This is true even when the embedded portion of H is >> identical to . >> > > The copy of >   H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ > is not >   Ĥ.H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ <Ĥ> > > it is actually >   Ĥ.H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ > > this is easily done by deleting <Ĥ> from the tape and inserting > Because my cancer came back too quickly (in less than 24 months) I can't afford the time to diverge from Linz until I have closure on Linz. I am on year 4.2 of a 50% five year mortality rate. Ĥ.H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ <Ĥ> ⊢* Ĥ.Hqn therefore H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* H.qy -- Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer