Path: ...!news-out.netnews.com!postmaster.netnews.com!us11.netnews.com!not-for-mail X-Trace: DXC=io0SJFIi>D096MEI[oS7`Ca2o_^63I1 X-Complaints-To: support@frugalusenet.com Date: Sat, 8 Jun 2024 22:41:25 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: Do you condemn Hamas? Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design References: <7er86jt9l8ob35kvnhieb0ne3cn2e12n5f@4ax.com> <6664ba53$1$2363151$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com> <6mf96jh39h1i69efmbvgu4o8kvos2tggii@4ax.com> Content-Language: en-US From: bitrex In-Reply-To: <6mf96jh39h1i69efmbvgu4o8kvos2tggii@4ax.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 108 Message-ID: <66651654$0$2363138$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 127.0.0.1 X-Trace: 1717900884 reader.netnews.com 2363138 127.0.0.1:42619 Bytes: 6076 On 6/8/2024 4:30 PM, john larkin wrote: > On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 16:08:51 -0400, bitrex wrote: > >> On 6/8/2024 3:55 PM, john larkin wrote: >>> On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman >>> wrote: >>> >>>> On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote: >>>>> On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote: >>>>>>>> On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Jeroen Belleman wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> [...] >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they >>>>>>>>>>>> are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So >>>>>>>>>>>> for Hamas, killing is always win-win. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Jeroen Belleman >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do >>>>>>>>>> this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past >>>>>>>>>> this one, >>>>>>>>>> and that you are immortal. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife, >>>>>>>>> just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the >>>>>>>>> result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events, >>>>>>>>> going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist, >>>>>>>>> never to come back, >>>>>>>>> when some essential part of my body fails. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of >>>>>>>>> being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of >>>>>>>>> those weird religious ideas. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Jeroen Belleman >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life. >>>>>>>> And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find >>>>>>>> the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife, >>>>>>> and what kind of experience do you expect to have? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Jeroen Belleman >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on >>>>>> this forum! >>>>> >>>>> Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum >>>>> consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky. >>>>> >>>>> Don't give up on miracles quite yet. >>>>> >>>> >>>> You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many >>>> times. In as far as the brain is a chemical machine, and >>>> that chemistry is basically a manifestation of quantum >>>> mechanics, I agree. In practice, QM is just a level too >>>> deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I believe that >>>> that is not how you see it. Would you elaborate? >>>> >>> >>> DNA and RNA and other things aren't flat linear molecules as the >>> cartoons suggest. They are twisted and tangled into writhing balls. So >>> any sequence gets continuously and randomly rubbed against the rest of >>> the string. That's a quantum cross-correlation machine. >>> >>>> Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle, >>>> though not in the mystical or religious sense. >>> >>> I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?" >>> >>> They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard >>> to explore an infinite space serially. >>> >>> There's nothing mystical about a universe that obviously works. >>> >> >> The "RNA world" hypothesis is that RNA is a very special molecule, the >> "killer app" that bootstrapped life. > > There are lots of people who want that to be true (never mind the > details) because they don't want to admit that other things might be > true. > > Nature has a rude habit of doing things that scientists didn't approve > of. > I tend to be of the opinion that actionable scientific theories of either how to get life to bootstrap from non-life in a lab environment, or how to make a machine emulate the significantly human qualities of a mind, will remain frustratingly elusive for the foreseeable future.