Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: H(D,D) cannot even be asked about the behavior of D(D) V3 ---IGNORING ALL OTHER REPLIES Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2024 08:03:56 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 81 Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2024 15:03:57 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="24f2a1964fe8769a85c52084edf5324e"; logging-data="711814"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/vHhGZLomEdtf2YHE4ll1q" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:U5ysZqYw+uIFtvvlh+2Lxr1lrUs= In-Reply-To: Content-Language: en-US Bytes: 4116 On 6/17/2024 2:20 AM, Mikko wrote: > On 2024-06-16 12:47:09 +0000, olcott said: > >> On 6/16/2024 2:53 AM, Mikko wrote: >>> On 2024-06-15 16:22:09 +0000, olcott said: >>> >>>> On 6/13/2024 8:24 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>  > On 6/13/24 11:32 AM, olcott wrote: >>>>  >> >>>>  >> It is contingent upon you to show the exact steps of how H computes >>>>  >> the mapping from the x86 machine language finite string input to >>>>  >> H(D,D) using the finite string transformation rules specified by >>>>  >> the semantics of the x86 programming language that reaches the >>>>  >> behavior of the directly executed D(D) >>>>  >> >>>>  > >>>>  > Why? I don't claim it can. >>>> >>>> The first six steps of this mapping are when instructions >>>> at the machine address range of [00000cfc] to [00000d06] >>>> are simulated/executed. >>>> >>>> After that the behavior of D correctly simulated by H diverges >>>> from the behavior of D(D) because the call to H(D,D) by D >>>> correctly simulated by H cannot possibly return to D. >>>> >>>> _D() >>>> [00000cfc](01) 55          push ebp >>>> [00000cfd](02) 8bec        mov ebp,esp >>>> [00000cff](03) 8b4508      mov eax,[ebp+08] >>>> [00000d02](01) 50          push eax       ; push D >>>> [00000d03](03) 8b4d08      mov ecx,[ebp+08] >>>> [00000d06](01) 51          push ecx       ; push D >>>> [00000d07](05) e800feffff  call 00000b0c  ; call H >>>> [00000d0c](03) 83c408      add esp,+08 >>>> [00000d0f](02) 85c0        test eax,eax >>>> [00000d11](02) 7404        jz 00000d17 >>>> [00000d13](02) 33c0        xor eax,eax >>>> [00000d15](02) eb05        jmp 00000d1c >>>> [00000d17](05) b801000000  mov eax,00000001 >>>> [00000d1c](01) 5d          pop ebp >>>> [00000d1d](01) c3          ret >>>> Size in bytes:(0034) [00000d1d] >>> >>> When you put "V2" or "V3" or something similar on the subject line >>> you should tell what is different from the original version. >>> >> >> I ask what are the steps >> I provide 6 steps and then ask what are the next steps. >> I provide all of the steps. > > In which version? > *This is the simplest possible version* void DDD() { H0(DDD); } After six steps of DDD are correctly emulated by H0 what machine address of DDD would it be at? _DDD() [00001fd2] 55 push ebp ; housekeeping [00001fd3] 8bec mov ebp,esp ; housekeeping [00001fd5] 68d21f0000 push 00001fd2 ; push DDD [00001fda] e8f3f9ffff call 000019d2 ; call H0 [00001fdf] 83c404 add esp,+04 ; housekeeping [00001fe2] 5d pop ebp ; housekeeping [00001fe3] c3 ret ; return to caller Size in bytes:(0018) [00001fe3] -- Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer