Path: ...!news.mixmin.net!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: Defining a correct simulating halt decider Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2024 19:21:36 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 93 Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2024 02:21:39 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="1fbca11ebde057c24ab486512c233e96"; logging-data="3409830"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX18YC6snjvirWXnJbfltrJ48" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:NRJA9wp/I1Gx0OwZGUpvEPWjj5Q= In-Reply-To: Content-Language: en-US Bytes: 4970 On 9/10/2024 3:52 AM, Mikko wrote: > On 2024-09-09 18:19:26 +0000, olcott said: > >> On 9/8/2024 9:53 AM, Mikko wrote: >>> On 2024-09-07 13:57:00 +0000, olcott said: >>> >>>> On 9/7/2024 3:29 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>> On 2024-09-07 05:12:19 +0000, joes said: >>>>> >>>>>> Am Fri, 06 Sep 2024 06:42:48 -0500 schrieb olcott: >>>>>>> On 9/6/2024 6:19 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>>>> On 2024-09-05 13:24:20 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>>>>> On 9/5/2024 2:34 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>>>>>> On 2024-09-03 13:00:50 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>>>>>>> On 9/3/2024 5:25 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> On 2024-09-02 16:38:03 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> A halt decider is a Turing machine that computes the >>>>>>>>>>>>> mapping from >>>>>>>>>>>>> its finite string input to the behavior that this finite >>>>>>>>>>>>> string >>>>>>>>>>>>> specifies. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> A halt decider needn't compute the full behaviour, only whether >>>>>>>>>>>> that behaviour is finite or infinite. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> New slave_stack at:1038c4 Begin Local Halt Decider Simulation >>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Local Halt Decider: Infinite Recursion Detected Simulation >>>>>>>>>>> Stopped >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hence  HHH(DDD)==0 is correct >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Nice to see that you don't disagree with what said. >>>>>>>>>> Unvortunately I can't agree with what you say. >>>>>>>>>> HHH terminates, >>>>>>>>>> os DDD obviously terminates, too. No valid >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> DDD emulated by HHH never reaches it final halt state. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> If that iis true it means that HHH called by DDD does not return >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> therefore is not a ceicder. >>>>>>> The directly executed HHH is a decider. >>>>>> What does simulating it change about that? >>>>> >>>>> If the simulation is incorrect it may change anything. >>>>> >>>> PATHOLOGICAL RELATIONSHIPS CHANGE BEHAVIOR >>>> PATHOLOGICAL RELATIONSHIPS CHANGE BEHAVIOR >>>> PATHOLOGICAL RELATIONSHIPS CHANGE BEHAVIOR >>>> PATHOLOGICAL RELATIONSHIPS CHANGE BEHAVIOR >>>> PATHOLOGICAL RELATIONSHIPS CHANGE BEHAVIOR >>> >>> However, a correct simultation faithfully imitates the original >>> behaviour. >>> >> >> _DDD() >> [00002172] 55         push ebp      ; housekeeping >> [00002173] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; housekeeping >> [00002175] 6872210000 push 00002172 ; push DDD >> [0000217a] e853f4ffff call 000015d2 ; call HHH(DDD) >> [0000217f] 83c404     add esp,+04 >> [00002182] 5d         pop ebp >> [00002183] c3         ret >> Size in bytes:(0018) [00002183] >> >> A correct emulation obeys the x86 machine code even >> if this machine code catches the machine on fire. >> >> It is impossible for an emulation of DDD by HHH to >> reach machine address 00002183 AND YOU KNOW IT!!! > > A correct emulation of DDD does reach the machine address 0000217f and > a little later 00002183. *That is counter-factual and you cannot possibly show otherwise* *Here are the verified facts* *any attempt to show otherwise cannot possibly succeed* DDD emulated by the directly executed HHH derived these steps: 00002172, 00002173, 00002175, 0000217a thus HHH emulated by the directly executed HHH cannot possibly derive and other steps and I have proved that it does not derive any other steps by the actual execution trace by a world class x86 emulator libx86emu. -- Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer