Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott Newsgroups: comp.theory,sci.logic Subject: Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? Date: Fri, 24 May 2024 14:57:15 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 112 Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Fri, 24 May 2024 21:57:15 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="853a48eea7a3e841565c364baea8e5bf"; logging-data="2603931"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX189aF57A2M1wsukRbEIRzCt" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:attbW6IFQBrldQFNJ7BAFwpGBHY= Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: Bytes: 5904 On 5/24/2024 6:18 AM, Richard Damon wrote: > On 5/23/24 11:59 PM, olcott wrote: >> On 5/23/2024 10:47 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>> On 5/23/24 11:06 PM, olcott wrote: >>>> On 5/23/2024 9:41 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>> On 5/23/24 10:22 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>> On 5/23/2024 8:44 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>>>> On 5/23/24 1:04 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>> typedef int (*ptr)();  // ptr is pointer to int function in C >>>>>>>> 00       int H(ptr p, ptr i); >>>>>>>> 01       int D(ptr p) >>>>>>>> 02       { >>>>>>>> 03         int Halt_Status = H(p, p); >>>>>>>> 04         if (Halt_Status) >>>>>>>> 05           HERE: goto HERE; >>>>>>>> 06         return Halt_Status; >>>>>>>> 07       } >>>>>>>> 08 >>>>>>>> 09       int main() >>>>>>>> 10       { >>>>>>>> 11         H(D,D); >>>>>>>> 12         return 0; >>>>>>>> 13       } >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The above template refers to an infinite set of H/D pairs where >>>>>>>> D is >>>>>>>> correctly simulated by pure function H. This was done because many >>>>>>>> reviewers used the shell game ploy to endlessly switch which H/D >>>>>>>> pair >>>>>>>> was being referred to. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> *Correct Simulation Defined* >>>>>>>>     This is provided because every reviewer had a different >>>>>>>> notion of >>>>>>>>     correct simulation that diverges from this notion. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>     A simulator is an x86 emulator that correctly emulates at >>>>>>>> least one >>>>>>>>     of the x86 instructions of D in the order specified by the x86 >>>>>>>>     instructions of D. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>     This may include correctly emulating the x86 instructions of >>>>>>>> H in >>>>>>>>     the order specified by the x86 instructions of H thus >>>>>>>> calling H(D,D) >>>>>>>>     in recursive simulation. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> *Execution Trace* >>>>>>>>     Line 11: main() invokes H(D,D); H(D,D) simulates lines 01, >>>>>>>> 02, and 03 >>>>>>>>     of D. This invokes H(D,D) again to repeat the process in >>>>>>>> endless >>>>>>>>     recursive simulation. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Questions: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> By your definiton of "Correct Simulation", you do realize that >>>>>>> you have broken connection between the simulaiton not completing >>>>>>> and the program described by the input not halting? >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> In other words you are requiring that the x86 instructions of D >>>>>> (and possibly H) be simulated incorrectly and/or in the wrong order. >>>>> >>>>> No, they must be simulated COMPLETELY. >>>>> >>>> >>>> (a) *Clearly you are terrible at reading a spec* >>>> (b) *non terminating computations cannot be simulated completely* >>> >>> Not by your definition, >>> >>> D(D) proves you wrong, since it HALTS when run, it terminates. >> *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* > > The FUNCTION D halts The strawman deception away form the subject of the subject line will not be tolerated. I let Ben Bacarisse get away with that for fifteen years. *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* *D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly halt* Not even after a quadrillion steps of correct simulation. -- Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer