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Failed to connect to MySQL: (1203) User howardkn already has more than 'max_user_connections' active connectionsPath: ...!weretis.net!feeder9.news.weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Mikko Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: How Partial Simulations correctly determine non-halting ---Ben's 10/2022 analysis Date: Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:42:02 +0300 Organization: - Lines: 41 Message-ID: References: <87h6eamkgf.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <_gWdnbwuZPJP2sL7nZ2dnZfqn_GdnZ2d@brightview.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Sat, 08 Jun 2024 08:42:02 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="701ca2b626bc5ff9a5c97350cec21277"; logging-data="2641818"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+Hlip/jnveHFOxzh6PVJ0Q" User-Agent: Unison/2.2 Cancel-Lock: sha1:tuiGHY5bxwl5r1tOnOMFIzXF25w= Bytes: 3206 On 2024-06-07 22:26:05 +0000, olcott said: > On 6/7/2024 4:00 PM, joes wrote: >> Am Fri, 07 Jun 2024 09:47:35 -0500 schrieb olcott: >>> On 6/7/2024 1:30 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>> On 2024-06-06 15:31:36 +0000, olcott said: >>>>> On 6/6/2024 10:14 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>> On 2024-06-06 13:53:58 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>>> On 6/6/2024 5:15 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>>>> On 2024-06-05 13:29:28 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>>>>> On 6/5/2024 2:37 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>>>>>> On 2024-06-04 18:02:03 +0000, olcott said: >> >>> A simulating halt decider cannot report on what the behavior of a >>> non-terminating input actually is because this would take forever. >> Exactly. Didn't you say it is allowed to abort? >> >>> H is not allowed to report on any computation containing its actual self >>> because Turing machines can only take finite string inputs thus cannot >>> take Turing machines as inputs. >> Bullshit. It can take other machines just fine. It doesn't know about >> itself. >> > > No actual Turing machine can be the input to any other actual > Turing machine. Turing machines only take finite string inputs. Any finite string can be an input to some Turing machine. Can you prove that a Turing machine is not a finite string? Your own attempts of a conter-proof are not about Turing machines but C programs. C programs are finite strings, so a C program is a valid input to a C program (and a Turing machine, too). >>> This means that H is not allowed to report on the behavior of the >>> directly executed P(P). >> So on which program does it report then? -- Mikko