Path: ...!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Fred. Zwarts" Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: People are still trying to get away with disagreeing with the semantics of the x86 language Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2024 21:31:10 +0200 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 68 Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2024 21:31:12 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="6cedb142f34e03a5852de86ea322d5ac"; logging-data="2418000"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX18wsRhFHFD9fwKV+e9xVVZ0" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:5/WdeC7fNqo7wAtM9pUjOh2Hsic= In-Reply-To: Content-Language: en-GB Bytes: 4736 Op 03.jul.2024 om 21:23 schreef olcott: > On 7/3/2024 2:15 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: >> Op 03.jul.2024 om 20:59 schreef olcott: >>> On 7/3/2024 1:46 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: >>>> Op 03.jul.2024 om 20:37 schreef olcott: >>>>> On 7/3/2024 1:25 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: >>>>>> Op 03.jul.2024 om 19:58 schreef olcott: >>>>>>> On 7/3/2024 12:51 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: >>>>>>>> Op 03.jul.2024 om 18:03 schreef olcott: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _DDD() >>>>>>> [00002172] 55               push ebp      ; housekeeping >>>>>>> [00002173] 8bec             mov ebp,esp   ; housekeeping >>>>>>> [00002175] 6872210000       push 00002172 ; push DDD >>>>>>> [0000217a] e853f4ffff       call 000015d2 ; call HHH(DDD) >>>>>>> [0000217f] 83c404           add esp,+04 >>>>>>> [00002182] 5d               pop ebp >>>>>>> [00002183] c3               ret >>>>>>> Size in bytes:(0018) [00002183] >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> DDD is correctly emulated by HHH which calls an emulated HHH(DDD) >>>>>>>>> to repeat this process an endless number of times until aborted >>>>>>>>> or out-of-memory error. >>>>>>>> Anyone knowing the x86 language knows that a program cannot be >>>>>>>> programmed to do two different things >>>>>>>> It cannot do both run out of memory *and* abort. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> DDD correctly emulated by any element of the infinite >>>>>>> set of every pure function HHH cannot possibly reach >>>>>>> its own ret instruction and halt. >>>>>> >>>>>> Exactly! Well done! This proves that HHH cannot possibly correctly >>>>>> simulate itself. If it aborts, it does so one cycle too soon. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> My system of reasoning could be used to make a chatbot >>>>> that would make all the propagandists look foolish even >>>>> to themselves. The alternative is the destruction of the >>>>> planet to earn a couple of more bucks. >>>>> >>>>> This is not some little game that can be played for >>>>> trollish sadism. It has consequences. >>>>> >>>> >>>> I appreciate this motivation, but it does not help to make the >>>> simulation correct. Better try something that can help, instead of >>>> spoiling your time with something that does not work as you expected. >>> >>> That you lie about how it works does not mean it doesn't work. >>> >> >> You are too soon with the words lie and liar. It does not contribute >> to a honest discussion. >> That you hope that it works, does not mean that it works, even when >> your hope is based on an appreciated motivation. > > You are essentially disagreeing with arithmetic. > There is an arithmetic to the meaning of words > and to the behavior of x86 code. > > When I say 2 + 3 = 5 you are not free to disagree > without big a liar. As soon as you disagree THAT MAKES YOU A LIAR > Irrelevant. I do not deny that 2+3=5. But if you claim that the x86 language says that a two cycle recursion must be aborted, then I know who is ignoring the truth.