Path: ...!news.nobody.at!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: Liar detector: Fred, Richard, Joes and Alan --- Honest Dialogue ? Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2024 08:28:36 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 70 Message-ID: References: <60a1c2490e9bd9a5478fd173a20ed64d5eb158f9@i2pn2.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2024 15:28:37 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="c302f5257903c7c25aa8d1f6976e7879"; logging-data="3724674"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+s9AEIbzPtsj6vRdzsq7cw" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:6hv63RMV3Ai6jcC5m8KOjHvSN5E= In-Reply-To: Content-Language: en-US Bytes: 4677 On 7/20/2024 3:54 AM, Mikko wrote: > On 2024-07-19 14:39:25 +0000, olcott said: > >> On 7/19/2024 3:51 AM, Mikko wrote: >>> On 2024-07-18 13:17:22 +0000, olcott said: >>> >>>> On 7/18/2024 2:40 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>> On 2024-07-17 13:00:55 +0000, olcott said: >>>>> >>>>>> On 7/17/2024 1:43 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>>> On 2024-07-16 14:21:28 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> When simulated input DDD stops running {if and only if} >>>>>>>> the simulation of this input DDD has been aborted this >>>>>>>> necessitates that input DDD specifies non-halting behavior >>>>>>> >>>>>>> DDD does not stop runnig unless it is completely exeuted. >>>>>> >>>>>> _DDD() >>>>>> [00002163] 55         push ebp      ; housekeeping >>>>>> [00002164] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; housekeeping >>>>>> [00002166] 6863210000 push 00002163 ; push DDD >>>>>> [0000216b] e853f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH(DDD) >>>>>> [00002170] 83c404     add esp,+04 >>>>>> [00002173] 5d         pop ebp >>>>>> [00002174] c3         ret >>>>>> Size in bytes:(0018) [00002174] >>>>>> >>>>>> DDD emulated by HHH according to the semantic meaning of >>>>>> its x86 instructions never stop running unless aborted. >>>>> >>>>> You mean HHH's simulation of DDD may not termite before HHH aborts it? >>>> >>>> When we examine the infinite set of every HHH/DDD pair such that: >>>> HHH₁ one step of DDD₁ is correctly emulated by HHH₁. >>>> HHH₂ two steps of DDD₂ are correctly emulated by HHH₂. >>>> HHH₃ three steps of DDD₃ are correctly emulated by HHH₃. >>>> ... >>>> HHH∞ The emulation of DDD∞ by HHH∞ never stops running. >>>> >>>> When each DDD of the HHH/DDD pairs above is correctly emulated >>>> by its corresponding HHH according to the semantic meaning of its >>>> x86 instructions it CANNOT POSSIBLY reach past its own machine >>>> address 0000216b, not even by an act of God. >>> >>> You apparently mean that no HHHᵢ can simulate the corresponding DDDᵢ to >>> its termination? >> >> No I don't mean that at all that incorrectly allocates the error >> to the emulator. > > Anyway you did not say that some HHHᵢ can simulate the corresponding DDDᵢ > to its termination. And each DDDᵢ does terminate, whether simulated or not. *Until you quit lying about this we cannot have an honest dialog* int main() { DDD(); } Calls HHH(DDD) that must abort the emulation of its input or {HHH, emulated DDD and executed DDD} never stop running. -- Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer