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Path: news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: Negative zero doesn't exist Date: Sat, 31 May 2025 13:46:37 +0200 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 31 Message-ID: <101eq6u$132j2$2@dont-email.me> References: <6Q4_P.1064760$wBt6.872942@fx15.ams4> <101bphk$d17c$1@dont-email.me> <101bsko$de5s$2@dont-email.me> <1a4454370856dd9988a51fcabf9734274cb23019@i2pn2.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Sat, 31 May 2025 13:46:38 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="ac754e71945de310b951b20d444add24"; logging-data="1149538"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+F7Kf/xrC8MwyrFRwp48hD" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:KBkrboDU4qhZqJvnpEw2Bt7vDX8= In-Reply-To: <1a4454370856dd9988a51fcabf9734274cb23019@i2pn2.org> Content-Language: nl, en-GB Op 30.mei.2025 om 16:10 schreef Richard Damon: > On 5/30/25 5:09 AM, Richard Heathfield wrote: >> On 30/05/2025 09:16, Mikko wrote: >> >> <snip> >> >>> However, when working with approximate values it may be useful >>> to know whether the true value is positive or negative even >>> when for other values a little more or less is insignifcant. >>> One such case is temperature where the difference between -0.1 >>> °C can be significantly different from +0.1 °C for practical >>> purpoises even when the difference between, say, 5 °C and 6 °C >>> isn't. >> >> Practical porpoises will avoid -0.1°C because it makes swimming too >> difficult. >> > > But porpoises swim in salt water, which will still be liquid at that > temperature, but colder than they like. > > > Minus 0 in IEEE is mostly an artifact of the representation, being a > sign + magnatude representation. Other systems have even more possibilities to represent 0. E.g., pencil and paper can be used to represent 0 as 0, 0.0, 0.00, 000, 00.0, 0.0E0, -0.0, etc. It is not uncommon that a single number can be represented in different ways in certain systems. Usually, nobody makes a problem of it, as it is understood that always the same number is represented.