Path: news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: 25 Classic Books That Have Been Banned
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2025 10:00:35 +0100
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On 02/06/2025 16:15, Paul S Person wrote:
> On Mon, 2 Jun 2025 03:16:02 +0100, Robert Carnegie
> <rja.carnegie@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> On 30/05/2025 16:37, Paul S Person wrote:
> 
> <snippo nonsense question I am responding to, and what led up to it>
> 
>>> OK. Why would what I merely /consider/ to be reality have to be
>>> factual? It isn't as if I am claiming it really is reality, only  that
>>> I consider it to be. Or do you want me to prove that I really do
>>> consider to be reality what I consider to be reality?
>>
>> If you consider it to be reality then you
>> presumably regard it as provable.
> 
> I think you are missing the thread here. Or maybe I am.
> 
> The question appears to be about "reality" as such. Not "the reality
> of this" or "the reality of that" or even "the existence of reality",
> but just "reality" -- and, even then, only what I consider to be
> reality.
> 
> As I said, all that appears to be provable is that what I consider to
> be reality really is what I consider to be reality. Since I make no
> statement that it actually /is/ reality, what else is there to prove?
> 
> <snip-a-bit>
> 
>> By the way - in that bible - there's a bit
>> about God creating things, including plants
>> on land, animals in the waters - but no plants
>> to live in water.  They seem to be around now,
>> !though.  Just a point to consider.  Did I
>> overlook that, or did God?  Did he fix it later
>> when no one was watching?
> 
> This is where one of Robert Graves suggestions comes in handy:
> 
> that the various sets of things created were assigned by the pagans to
> various deities, and the account in Genesis is intended to say "no,
> God, the God of Israel, did that".
> 
> In that case, the lack of aquatic vegetation mignt be taken to mean
> that there was no pagan deity responsible for having created it.
> 
> Alternately, we could discuss the problems with scribes hand-copying
> manuscripts -- for example, drop-outs.
> 
> There are (IIRC) two versions of this account (one in Psalms, one in
> Proverbs -- IIRC) but, IIRC, they end early in the process (Earth,
> Sun, Moon, Stars) and say nothing about days. This raises the
> possibility of later additions in Genesis 1 to the original account.

Do you mean Psalm 104?  That has a bit that
I had lost track of - that God is responsible
for stopping the sea tide from flooding the
land - again - and keeping it where it belongs.

On biblical truth, I'll just point out that
we do see the waters of the sea flooding over
land from time to time.

Perhaps a Jesuit will say that the Psalm
is referring specifically to Israel, and not
to other places where that sort of thing
has happened.

If it has happened in Israel, then the Jesuit
will have to think of another argument to use.