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From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: The execution trace of HHH1(DDD) shows the divergence
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2025 10:58:46 -0500
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On 6/13/2025 6:41 AM, Mikko wrote:
> On 2025-06-12 14:21:39 +0000, Richard Damon said:
> 
>> On 6/12/25 12:44 AM, olcott wrote:
>>> On 6/11/2025 8:29 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>> On 6/11/25 8:03 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>> On 6/11/2025 4:06 PM, anthk wrote:
>>>>>> On 2025-06-07, olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> The execution trace of HHH1(DDD) shows the divergence
>>>>>>> of DDD emulated by HHH from DDD emulated by HHH1.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> int main()
>>>>>>> {
>>>>>>>     HHH1(DDD);
>>>>>>> }
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Shows that DDD emulated by HHH and DDD emulated by
>>>>>>> HHH1 diverges as soon as HHH begins emulating itself
>>>>>>> emulating DDD.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *From the execution trace of HHH1(DDD) shown below*
>>>>>>> DDD emulated by HHH1              DDD emulated by HHH
>>>>>>> [00002183] push ebp               [00002183] push ebp
>>>>>>> [00002184] mov ebp,esp            [00002184] mov ebp,esp
>>>>>>> [00002186] push 00002183 ; DDD    [00002186] push 00002183 ; DDD
>>>>>>> [0000218b] call 000015c3 ; HHH    [0000218b] call 000015c3 ; HHH
>>>>>>> *HHH1 emulates DDD once then HHH emulates DDD once, these match*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The next instruction of DDD that HHH emulates is at
>>>>>>> the machine address of 00002183.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The next instruction of DDD that HHH1 emulates is at
>>>>>>> the machine address of 00002190.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 00002183 != 00002190
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _DDD()
>>>>>>> [00002183] 55             push ebp
>>>>>>> [00002184] 8bec           mov ebp,esp
>>>>>>> [00002186] 6883210000     push 00002183 ; push DDD
>>>>>>> [0000218b] e833f4ffff     call 000015c3 ; call HHH
>>>>>>> [00002190] 83c404         add esp,+04
>>>>>>> [00002193] 5d             pop ebp
>>>>>>> [00002194] c3             ret
>>>>>>> Size in bytes:(0018) [00002194]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _main()
>>>>>>> [000021a3] 55             push ebp
>>>>>>> [000021a4] 8bec           mov ebp,esp
>>>>>>> [000021a6] 6883210000     push 00002183 ; push DDD
>>>>>>> [000021ab] e843f3ffff     call 000014f3 ; call HHH1
>>>>>>> [000021b0] 83c404         add esp,+04
>>>>>>> [000021b3] 33c0           xor eax,eax
>>>>>>> [000021b5] 5d             pop ebp
>>>>>>> [000021b6] c3             ret
>>>>>>> Size in bytes:(0020) [000021b6]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    machine   stack     stack     machine    assembly
>>>>>>>    address   address   data      code       language
>>>>>>>   ========  ========  ========  ========== =============
>>>>>>> <main is executed>
>>>>>>> [000021a3][0010382d][00000000] 55         push ebp      ; main()
>>>>>>> [000021a4][0010382d][00000000] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; main()
>>>>>>> [000021a6][00103829][00002183] 6883210000 push 00002183 ; push DDD
>>>>>>> [000021ab][00103825][000021b0] e843f3ffff call 000014f3 ; call HHH1
>>>>>>> </main is executed>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> New slave_stack at:1038d1
>>>>>>> Begin Local Halt Decider Simulation   Execution Trace Stored 
>>>>>>> at:1138d9
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <DDD emulated by HHH1>
>>>>>>> [00002183][001138c9][001138cd] 55         push ebp      ; DDD of 
>>>>>>> HHH1
>>>>>>> [00002184][001138c9][001138cd] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; DDD of 
>>>>>>> HHH1
>>>>>>> [00002186][001138c5][00002183] 6883210000 push 00002183 ; push DDD
>>>>>>> [0000218b][001138c1][00002190] e833f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH
>>>>>>> </DDD emulated by HHH1>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> New slave_stack at:14e2f9
>>>>>>> Begin Local Halt Decider Simulation   Execution Trace Stored 
>>>>>>> at:15e301
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <DDD emulated by HHH>
>>>>>>> [00002183][0015e2f1][0015e2f5] 55         push ebp      ; DDD of 
>>>>>>> HHH[0]
>>>>>>> [00002184][0015e2f1][0015e2f5] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; DDD of 
>>>>>>> HHH[0]
>>>>>>> [00002186][0015e2ed][00002183] 6883210000 push 00002183 ; push DDD
>>>>>>> [0000218b][0015e2e9][00002190] e833f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH
>>>>>>> <DDD emulated by HHH>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> New slave_stack at:198d21  DDD emulated by HHH
>>>>>>> *This is the beginning of the divergence of the behavior*
>>>>>>> *HHH is emulating itself emulating DDD, HHH1 never does that*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <DDD emulated by HHH emulating itself>
>>>>>>> [00002183][001a8d19][001a8d1d] 55         push ebp      ; DDD of 
>>>>>>> HHH[1]
>>>>>>> [00002184][001a8d19][001a8d1d] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; DDD of 
>>>>>>> HHH[1]
>>>>>>> [00002186][001a8d15][00002183] 6883210000 push 00002183 ; push DDD
>>>>>>> [0000218b][001a8d11][00002190] e833f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH
>>>>>>> </DDD emulated by HHH emulating itself>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Local Halt Decider: Infinite Recursion Detected Simulation Stopped
>>>>>>> HHH returns to caller
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <DDD emulated by HHH1>
>>>>>>> [00002190][001138c9][001138cd] 83c404     add esp,+04 ; DDD of HHH1
>>>>>>> [00002193][001138cd][000015a8] 5d         pop ebp     ; DDD of HHH1
>>>>>>> [00002194][001138d1][0003a980] c3         ret         ; DDD of HHH1
>>>>>>> </DDD emulated by HHH1>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <main is executed>
>>>>>>> [000021b0][0010382d][00000000] 83c404     add esp,+04 ; main()
>>>>>>> [000021b3][0010382d][00000000] 33c0       xor eax,eax ; main()
>>>>>>> [000021b5][00103831][00000018] 5d         pop ebp     ; main()
>>>>>>> [000021b6][00103835][00000000] c3         ret         ; main()
>>>>>>> </main is executed>
>>>>>>> Number of Instructions Executed(352831) == 5266 Pages
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lean Lisp first, ideally with Scheme. Go get Concrete Abstractions
>>>>>> and learn about recursivity and taill call optimization.
>>>>>
>>>>> Tail optimization would at best convert recursive emulation
>>>>> into an infinite loop.
>>>>
>>>> Only for the DDD that calls the HHH that never aborts.
>>>>
>>>> Sorry, but you admission to the facts that show that all your claims 
>>>> are just lies based on the category error of you not making HHH 
>>>> actually a fixed programs, and thus DDD isn't a program, and thus 
>>>> not something that CAN be correctly simulated, just shows that you 
>>>> don't care about what the truth actualy is.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> void DDD()
>>>>> {
>>>>>    HHH(DDD);
>>>>>    return;
>>>>> }
>>>>>
>>>>> DDD correctly emulated by HHH cannot possibly reach its
>>>>> own "return" statement final halt state, thus is correctly
>>>>> rejected by HHH as non-halting.
>>>>
>>>> Something that can not happen by your stipulations,
>>>>
>>>> Sorry, you have ADMITTED that this statement can't be true by 
>>>> admitting that DDD isn't amoundg the category of things that can be 
>>>> simulated.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> int DD()
>>>>> {
>>>>>    int Halt_Status = HHH(DD);
>>>>>    if (Halt_Status)
>>>>>      HERE: goto HERE;
>>>>>    return Halt_Status;
>>>>> }
>>>>>
>>>>> The point of all of this is that the halting problem's
>>>>> counter-example input is also correctly rejected as
>>>>> non-halting thus refuting the conventional HP proof.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> No it isn't, and the fact that you have admitted to the facts that 
>>>> show that you have just been lying all these years about your system 
>>>> being the equivalent of the halting problem proof, just shows how 
========== REMAINDER OF ARTICLE TRUNCATED ==========