Path: news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Riding a bike a protection and in general
Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2025 11:17:12 -0400
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 58
Message-ID: <102s0tp$2etef$3@dont-email.me>
References: <102na8l$144h0$1@dont-email.me> <mba755F9o8uU1@mid.individual.net>
 <71qv4kdbqa0dri9tjhveqm88cnhn1sm2mu@4ax.com> <102p49s$1km20$3@dont-email.me>
 <fn905klni9gp20oeijcq7g24k77rtqgtjn@4ax.com> <102pecp$1ngsl$1@dont-email.me>
 <102pfb8$1mt6u$9@dont-email.me> <102pk6i$1ouco$2@dont-email.me>
 <hnn05k10bcun2dftnhbm910trvbrpnn8eb@4ax.com> <102pq6i$1qde4$2@dont-email.me>
 <102qjcr$2495c$3@dont-email.me> <ldb25ktnfran83ju1inrg2kd2pc27lbdio@4ax.com>
 <102rpfd$2d8o9$3@dont-email.me>
Reply-To: frkrygow@gmail.com
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2025 17:17:14 +0200 (CEST)
Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="b7c222e78b8dfbeb9b0b9aea65f47eef";
	logging-data="2586063"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";	posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/iJjZVLNZQaLEqIaNLPTjnt9Evr6U8V1Q="
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Cancel-Lock: sha1:l585QscAFfM6c6i6DXA0/4bksMM=
In-Reply-To: <102rpfd$2d8o9$3@dont-email.me>
Content-Language: en-US

On 6/17/2025 9:10 AM, AMuzi wrote:
> On 6/17/2025 3:56 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
>> On Mon, 16 Jun 2025 22:20:11 -0400, Frank Krygowski
>> <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>
>>> On 6/16/2025 3:10 PM, AMuzi wrote:
>>>> My point was that there's no general rule and should not be.
>>>>
>>>> Firearms can be useful, they are also frequently misused, and violence
>>>> of all sorts happens with or without firearms.
>>>
>>> The general rule is: If you have a firearm for "defense" it's because
>>> you're afraid of something or someone. ...
> 
> 'Fear' yes but not without reason.  Does 'fear' apply to all the 
> millions of people with a baseball bat and/or machete near the door or 
> only firearms?  'Prudence' may be a better word.

"Prudence" is related to fear, because without something to fear at 
least a little bit there's nothing to be prudent about. And whether the 
proper word is prudence or paranoia depends on the actual level of risk.

Unlike some here, I think it's nonsense to say that nothing is 
quantifiable, that _everything_ is subjective. That attitude is just a 
lazy thinker's way of pretending one's uninformed opinion is always right.

I don't buy that attitude - maybe in part because in my profession, I 
was paid to (among many other things) correct other's mistakes. My 
education taught me to pay attention to data, and I taught that to others.

So let's concentrate on one topic, and ask about data. Our timid 
tricycle rider will not ride on a quiet suburban bike path unless he has 
a handgun ready within seconds to shoot someone. What's the data 
justifying that paranoia? What's the frequency of people on that path 
needing deadly force to defend themselves? What's the risk of serious 
attack per million hours of Florida path riding?

I think the risk is so low that nobody has bothered to even begin counting.

Earlier this year I rode several Florida bike paths, as well as many 
streets and roads. Neither I nor the Floridians I rode with carried 
weaponry, and I'm sure if I'd proposed it those Floridians would have 
scoffed.

But if someone does refuse to ride without a handgun, it can only be 
because there is some level of fear - in this case, a fear greater than 
that of the young mothers pushing baby carriages on the same trail. You 
can say the level of risk is too high for him, in his personal reality; 
but that's the reality of a timid, timid person. You can call it 
"prudence" but it's really paranoia.

And about the possibility of a home invasion that started this thread: 
For the location where the Deacon lives, how often do home invasions 
happen? I'm betting the count is almost precisely zero. But what's the 
data?

-- 
- Frank Krygowski