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From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: HHH(DDD) is correct to reject its input as non-halting ---
 EVIDENCE THAT I AM CORRECT
Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2025 09:34:33 -0500
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On 6/29/2025 4:10 AM, Mikko wrote:
> On 2025-06-28 13:51:21 +0000, olcott said:
> 
>> On 6/28/2025 6:56 AM, Mikko wrote:
>>> On 2025-06-27 14:26:41 +0000, olcott said:
>>>
>>>> On 6/27/2025 1:42 AM, Mikko wrote:
>>>>> On 2025-06-27 04:21:01 +0000, olcott said:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 6/26/2025 5:20 AM, Mikko wrote:>>>
>>>>>>> In computer science the only measure of non-halting is the
>>>>>>> possibility to execute an unlimited number of steps without
>>>>>>> halting. An execution of a limited number of steps does not
>>>>>>> count as non-haltign.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Halting means reaching a final halt state.
>>>>>
>>>>> And non-halting means unlimited execution.
>>>>
>>>> Not at all. The measure has always been can't possibly reach
>>>> final halt state.
>>>
>>> In Post's simplified version, which is the most commonly used one,
>>> a computation halts when there is no applicable rule to specify
>>> the next action.
>>
>> It is best to use the standard measure of halting
>> as reaching a final halt state.
> 
> If you use Turing's original form of Turing maches then it is best to
> use Turing's definition of halting. If you are using some usual form
> then the usual criterion that halting means inability to contimue.
> Otherwise you get the paradox that a computation cannot be continued
> but it has not halted, either.
> 

Because no one ever thought of a simulating partial halt
decider (SPHD) before as a partial halt decider (PHD) we
must divide halting from an aborted simulation.

If we don't do this then actual infinite loops will
be misconstrued as halting because their SPHD stopped
simulating them.

>> If we don't do this then we get psychotic ideas like Richard's that
>> we cannot know that a computation does not halt until after we
>> simulate it forever.
> 
> It is a sin to lie about other people.
> 
> Anyway, you don't know that a computation does not halt unless you
> can prove it. There is no method that can find a proof in all cases
> but that doesn't prevent from finding a proof for some non-halting
> cases.
> 

This very simple proof seems too difficult for anyone
to understand.

void DDD()
{
   HHH(DDD);
   return;
}

_DDD()
[00002192] 55             push ebp
[00002193] 8bec           mov ebp,esp
[00002195] 6892210000     push 00002192  // push DDD
[0000219a] e833f4ffff     call 000015d2  // call HHH
[0000219f] 83c404         add esp,+04
[000021a2] 5d             pop ebp
[000021a3] c3             ret
Size in bytes:(0018) [000021a3]

The x86 source code of DDD specifies that this emulated
DDD cannot possibly reach its own emulated "ret" instruction
final halt state when emulated by HHH according to the
semantics of the x86 language.

-- 
Copyright 2025 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer