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From: Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Whoops! The Atlantic Makes Trump Look EPIC In Cover Intended as a Smear
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2024 08:31:25 -0700
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On Fri, 25 Oct 2024 08:27:59 -0700, Bobbie Sellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> wrote:

>On 10/25/24 06:45, Chris Buckley wrote:
>> On 2024-10-25, D <nospam@example.net> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 24 Oct 2024, The Horny Goat wrote:
>>>> I'm from BC (Canada) and had our provincial election Saturday. I =
voted
>>>> in the advance poll at our local recreation center which is about =
2-3
>>>> miles from home and fairly close to my favorite grocery store. Can't
>>>> recall whether I voted first shopped after or vice versa but it was
>>>> the same trip away from home. My candidate didn't win but that's not
>>>> the point - far better to have voted and lost than not to have voted
>>>> at all.
>>>>
>>> I disagree. If there is no candidate that represents my view, I would=
 be
>>> doing democracy a disservice by voting. By not voting, I send a clear
>>> signal that the current politicians are of low quality and/or =
incompetent,
>>> and that they in no way deserve me participating in the system.
>>=20
>> I very strongly disagree. Voting is critical; at a minimum we must
>> distinguish our distaste for current candidates from the apathetic not
>> caring about the issue. Vote for the candidate you agree with most; if
>> there actually are none, then write-in "Mickey Mouse" or "Hatsune
>> Miku" if you're somewhat younger. That sends a clear signal; not
>> voting sends nothing at all in the US (it does send a signal in those
>> countries with mandatory voting.) You are not going to find a
>> candidate that represents your view 100% unless you're the candidate
>> yourself.
>>=20
>> This is now the third Presidential election in a row that I can't vote
>> for either major party candidate - in the previous 40 years it only
>> happened once. Times are changing. But the need to vote is still =
there.
>>=20
>>> In additiona, democracy is a violent act, since it represents you, =
through
>>> the possible force of the majority, imposing your will on others, by =
the
>>> threat of violence if they do not comply. This is unethical.
>>>
>>> Pacifists and libertarians can, due to their ethics and political =
beliefs,
>>> not vote in democratic elections and remain consistent with their =
moral
>>> positions.
>>=20
>> D, I would not have thought that you were that much a proponent of
>> today's cancel culture. The modern notion that if you object strongly
>> to one belief of a person or group/party you must completely =
disassociate
>> yourself from that person or group, is tearing apart our society.  =
We're
>> unable to discuss or even recognize the good qualities of that =
person/group.
>>=20
>> There's no reason for pacifists and libertarians not to participate in
>> a democracy despite their disagreement about what some of what a
>> government should do. That's cancel culture.  Would you really not
>> vote for someone like Chase Oliver (Libertarian Party candidate)
>> because of that, D?  Just about the only group who philosophically
>> should not vote are the anarchists.
>>=20
>> As they say "Democracy sucks; it just sucks less than the =
alternatives."
>>=20
>> Chris
>>=20
>
>	All American Anarchists should always vote for the most competent=20
>candidate.  We should do that because as bad as
>government is it is far better constrained by even imperfect
>basic law than by men acting on whims and without information.
>	 We see in nations where Government has collapsed and
>anarchy prevales that misery excalates. We see in nations
>ruled by dictatorships of the Left or of the Right that misery
>ensues. So goverment by the Constitution is better but certain
>branches of the Government have resigned their proper functions
>and allowed one or more other branches to improperly
>execute the duty of other branches. One branch has the duty
>of comparing non-basic law to the basic law for conflict
>but the so called justices have dragged the common law of
>superstitious monarchies into the case. They presume to
>place their interpretation of religion against modern science
>and in addition prominent members have accepted large gifts
>from parties who have interests in the presented cases.

An excellent summary of our current situation. Just two quibbles and
an observation:

1. Freedom of religion and a prohibition on a State Church (which
would include Science acting as a religion, BTW) /are/ part of the
basic law (the Constitution, as amended).

2. The concept that human life begins at conception /is/ modern
science; they are merely drawing the inevitable consequences from this
belief. It is truly amazing that so many anti-modernist Christians
("Evangelicals") have adopted the /scientific/ viewpoint and abandoned
the historical Christian viewpoint (that human life begins when the
child draws breath independently of the mother. And, yes, spending
time on a respirator for a while /does/ count.)

3. Abortion has been discouraged for a long long time. The Hippocratic
Oath, from 3 or 4 centuries BC, includes a pledge by doctors not to
provide a drug to induce one. But this was because they believed the
fetus to be a human being (except potentially); it was because they
believed it to be the property of the father. Abortion was regarded as
a form of property theft. Keep in mind that the mother was also,
unless hanky-panky was involved, the property of the father.
--=20
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"