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From: Spalls Hurgenson <spallshurgenson@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: Re: [boing boing] D&D's latest module, "Vecna: Eve of Ruin," and the trouble with high-level adventures
Date: Tue, 04 Jun 2024 10:27:43 -0400
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On Tue, 4 Jun 2024 05:51:14 -0000 (UTC), lkh <lkh@sdf-eu.org> wrote:

>Spalls Hurgenson <spallshurgenson@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Mon, 3 Jun 2024 12:29:55 +0200, Kyonshi <gmkeros@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>>>Source: 
>>>https://boingboing.net/2024/06/03/dds-latest-module-vecna-eve-of-ruin-and-the-trouble-with-high-level-adventures.html
>>>
>>>
>>>D&D's latest module, "Vecna: Eve of Ruin," and the trouble with 
>>>high-level adventures
>>>Gareth Branwyn 3:00 am Mon Jun 3, 2024
>>>
>> 
>> That's not to say you can't have fun high-level D&D games, but it
>> often feels like a struggle; you're fighting against a system that
>> just isn't designed to scale up that high. Other systems are better
>> suited to those sorts of power levels (Exalted, for instance) but D&D?
>> It's meant for low-level play.
>
>let's put it like this: D&D in *dungeon crawling* mode doesn't scale 
>up that well. *Hex crawl* mode does scale better I feel, and the 
>*domain game* is literally made for high level play. 
>
>To my mind *domain game* play, is much more free form than the more 
>basic modes of play. It should generally be ruled by common sense and
>be driven by political scheming of experienced players. Little place
>for D&D's basic combat rules here.
>
>However, *that's* very hard to put in a module I guess, which could 
>be the reason why a lot of high level modules so far are really 
>bloated mid level modules.

More, the entire system isn't well designed to scale up. In fact, it's
purposefully designed to make high-level players feel weaker than they
should. The "Earthquake" spell above is one example. "Wish" is
another. You never really get to the point of being a world-shaker in
D&D, because it's a game designed around squad-level combat. You CAN
have high-level adventures... but that's DESPITE the system. The D&D
rules neither encourage nor really assist the DM or players. It's
designed to keep you dungeon-crawling, whether that's against kobolds
at 1st level or a tarrasque at 20th.


>Let me point out again, I don't mean to say you're playing the game
>wrong, when your combats are boring. If you and your group don't 
>like combat, maybe it's better to just roll percentiles to see who 
>won and cut the whole thing short. That's fine too. But if you do
>like a tactical game on your table, don't skimp it, pull all the
>options and make it interesting!
>

<chuckle> I never said our battles are boring. Just that the enjoyment
doesn't scale up with level. It's pretty much the same but with
flashier effects and more HP to grind down.



>Coming back to the module (at last) ... Vecna trying to destroy
>the multiverse?! Damn it, I'm intrigued!

Meh. I'd be more excited about it if this wasn't old hat already. "Oh
look, new edition! Let's have Vecna destroy the multiverse again!" Or
if Vecna was actually an interesting character, for that matter. WoTC
(and TSR before them) has been playing him up for decades, but he's
such a one-note villain that the 'head of Vecna' gag is still the most
interesting thing about him.