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Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> Newsgroups: comp.arch Subject: Re: 80286 protected mode Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2024 11:59:27 +0300 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 38 Message-ID: <20241015115927.00001015@yahoo.com> References: <2024Oct6.150415@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> <2024Oct7.093314@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> <ve3kuh$22nr$1@gal.iecc.com> <2024Oct8.182332@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> <ve46nc$2leh$1@gal.iecc.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2024 10:58:53 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="b82f3ff387ea9347e32983188b873679"; logging-data="1720587"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX19O6VKu3MXj9nAIZ/aGCxgkAJTv1r9Bryc=" Cancel-Lock: sha1:OQtn07oq3hDwVtODNBfQdSlIfRU= X-Newsreader: Claws Mail 3.19.1 (GTK+ 2.24.33; x86_64-w64-mingw32) Bytes: 2414 On Tue, 8 Oct 2024 21:03:40 -0000 (UTC) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote: > According to Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>: > >>If you look at the 8086 manuals, that's clearly what they had in > >>mind. > >> > >>What I don't get is that the 286's segment stuff was so slow. > > > >It had to load the whole segment descriptor from RAM and possibly > >perform some additional setup. > > Right, and they appeared not to care or realize it was a performance > problem. > > They didn't even do obvious things like see if you're reloading the > same value into the segment register and skip the rest of the setup. > Sure, you could put checks in your code and skip the segment load but > that would make your code a lot bigger and uglier. > The question is how slowness of 80286 segments compares to contemporaries that used segment-based protected memory. Wikipedia lists following machines as examples of segmentation: - Burroughs B5000 and following Burroughs Large Systems - GE 645 -> Honeywell 6080 - Prime 400 and successors - IBM System/38 They also mention S/370, but to me segmentation in S/370 looks very different and probably not intended for fine-grained protection. Of those Burroughs B5900 looks to me as the most comparable to 80286.