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From: Justisaur <justisaur@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action
Subject: Re: How not to start the day
Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2024 13:52:26 -0800
Organization: i2pn2 (i2pn.org)
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On 12/5/2024 7:47 AM, Spalls Hurgenson wrote:
> On Wed, 04 Dec 2024 14:21:12 -0500, Mike S. <Mike_S@nowhere.com>
> wrote:
> 
>> On Wed, 04 Dec 2024 14:14:16 -0500, Spalls Hurgenson
>> <spallshurgenson@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> (I also today received a notification that "content of mine has been
>>> removed" because it "violated community guidelines" without any clues
>>> as to what content that was, or how it violated the guidelines. All it
>>> said was "comment", which doesn't really narrow it down much. I've
>>> contacted Steam customer service AGAIN for clarification)
>>
>> If they reply to you and you don't mind sharing it here, I would like
>> to know exactly what you said that violated their guidelines. I am
>> very curious.
> 
> So, it turns out "the content that violated the community guidelines"
> was the exact same comment that earlier got triggered for being
> 'suspicious content'. (see initial comment if you want the exact
> wording).
> 
> So, they closed my account for that comment, then -when challenged-
> agreed that there was nothing wrong with the comment, and then the
> next day deleted it anyway.
> 
> I (politely) pressed Steam for details, asking how the comment
> violated community guidelines so I could avoid doing so in the future,
> and was told:
> 
>         "In this case, we do not have any recommendations based
>         on the content of your comment, as it does not actually
>         appear to include suspicious material."
> 
> Nonetheless, they did not restore the comment. (They did suggest I
> could repost the comment should I chose ;-)
> 
> As stated in other posts, I've no real issue with the underlying
> principles behind these actions. Monitoring user activity in order to
> prevent account hacks or for purposes of moderation is common sense
> practice. What I do take umbrage with is /how/ it is done. There is
> -not only on Steam, but other online services- such a lack of
> transparency that not even the ADMINISTRATORS understand what
> triggered these actions. Worse, action is taken on accounts without
> any oversight; the algorithm flags content and action is immediately
> taken, leaving the end-user very little recourse.
> 
> I was fortunate that Valve restored my account. But unfortunately all
> the power is in their hands, and very little is on the other side of
> the contract. That is extremely problematic, not just with Steam but
> with all other Internet interactions.
> 
> I have a significant level of distrust of Valve's platform now. Who
> knows what little thing I may say or do that might trigger the
> over-eager algorithm? It makes me a lot willing to engage with the
> community features (playing online, making comments, writing reviews,
> providing artwork), which were one of the major draws of the platform
> over its competitors. At least if GOG cancels my account, I don't lose
> several (tens of?) thousands of dollars worth of games.

So banned account as in you just couldn't post anything, or as in you 
can't play any of your (tens of?) thousands of games?

I never really trusted Steam, I suppose that's why I rarely post 
anything there, especially negative for fear of the same, they hold my 
most treasured games hostage afterall.

As to their algorithm, I believe you posted about them changing to AI 
moderation, which is orders of magnitude more difficult, or impossible 
to figure out what the hell it's doing in the black box of it's program. 
  From what I've read on it, basically no one knows what it's doing and 
all they can do is retrain it, or implement layers on top of it that try 
to stop it from doing things they don't want it to.  Then there's the 
fact they may not even actually try to stop it from doing things that 
they *say* they don't want it to, or that one would expect fairness out of.




-- 
-Justisaur

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