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From: Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org>
Newsgroups: sci.logic
Subject: Re: This makes all Analytic(Olcott) truth computable
Date: Sat, 17 Aug 2024 11:33:50 -0400
Organization: i2pn2 (i2pn.org)
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On 8/17/24 11:12 AM, olcott wrote:
> On 8/17/2024 9:53 AM, Richard Damon wrote:
>> On 8/17/24 10:45 AM, olcott wrote:
>>> On 8/17/2024 9:40 AM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>> On 8/17/24 12:05 AM, olcott wrote:
>>>>> On 8/16/2024 5:57 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>>>> On 8/16/24 6:40 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>>> On 8/16/2024 5:19 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 8/16/24 6:16 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 8/16/2024 5:03 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 8/16/24 5:35 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 8/16/2024 4:05 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 8/16/24 4:39 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 8/16/2024 2:42 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 8/16/24 2:11 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 8/16/2024 11:32 AM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 8/16/24 7:02 AM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *This abolishes the notion of undecidability*
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As with all math and logic we have expressions of language
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that are true on the basis of their meaning expressed
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in this same language. Unless expression x has a 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> connection
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (through a sequence of true preserving operations) in 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> system
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> F to its semantic meanings expressed in language L of F
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> x is simply untrue in F.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But you clearly don't understand the meaning of 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "undecidability"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Not at all. I am doing the same sort thing that ZFC
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> did to conquer Russell's Paradox.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want to do that, you need to start at the basics 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are totally reformulate logic.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ZFC didn't need to do that. All they had to do is
>>>>>>>>>>>>> redefine the notion of a set so that it was no longer
>>>>>>>>>>>>> incoherent.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I guess you haven't read the papers of Zermelo and Fraenkel. 
>>>>>>>>>>>> They created a new definition of what a set was, and then 
>>>>>>>>>>>> showed what that implies, since by changing the definitions, 
>>>>>>>>>>>> all the old work of set theory has to be thrown out, and 
>>>>>>>>>>>> then we see what can be established.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> None of this is changing any more rules. All
>>>>>>>>>>> of these are the effects of the change of the
>>>>>>>>>>> definition of a set.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> No, they defined not only what WAS a set, but what you could 
>>>>>>>>>> do as basic operations ON a set.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Axiom of extensibility: the definition of sets being equal, 
>>>>>>>>>> that ZFC is built on first-order logic.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Axion of regularity/Foundation: This is the rule that a set 
>>>>>>>>>> can not be a member of itself, and that we can count the 
>>>>>>>>>> members of a set.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> This one is the key that conquered Russell's Paradox.
>>>>>>>>> If anything else changed it changed on the basis of this change
>>>>>>>>> or was not required to defeat RP.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> but they couldn't just "add" it to set theory, they needed to 
>>>>>>>> define the full set.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think you problem is you just don't understand how formal 
>>>>>>>> logic works.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think at a higher level of abstraction.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No, you don't, unless you mean by that not bothering to make sure 
>>>>>> the details work.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You can't do fundamental logic in the abstract.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That is just called fluff and bluster.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> All that they did is just like I said they redefined
>>>>>>> what a set is. You provided a whole bunch of details of
>>>>>>> how they redefined a set as a rebuttal to my statement
>>>>>>> saying that all they did is redefine a set.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Showing the sort of thing YOU need to do to redefine logic
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I said that ZFC redefined the notion of a set to get rid of RP.
>>>>> You show the steps of how ZFC redefined a set as your rebuttal.
>>>>
>>>> No, you said that "ALL THEY DID" was that, and that is just a LIE.
>>>>
>>>> They developed a full formal system.
>>>>
>>>
>>> They did nothing besides change the definition of
>>> a set and the result of this was a new formal system.
>>>
>>
>> I guess you consider all the papers they wrote describing the effects 
>> of their definitions "nothing"
>>
> 
> Not at all and you know this.
> One change had many effects yet was still one change.
> 

But would mean nothing without showing the affects of that change.

Just TRY to use that one change without everything else that was derived 
from that system. You would first need to recreate all the work they did.

But then, you don't seem to understand that you should only use PROVEN 
statements to make you claims, and not just things that "seem" correct, 
because you just don't understand how logic works.