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From: john larkin <jl@glen--canyon.com>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: The Physics Behind the Spanish Blackout
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2025 07:58:33 -0700
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On Mon, 9 Jun 2025 18:10:14 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

>On 6/9/2025 2:37 PM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>> On 6/9/25 17:34, bitrex wrote:
>>> On 6/9/2025 10:14 AM, Joe Gwinn wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 08 Jun 2025 17:16:09 -0700, john larkin <jl@glen--canyon.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, 08 Jun 2025 19:15:57 -0400, Joe Gwinn <joegwinn@comcast.net>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Physics Behind the Spanish Blackout, Bjorn Lomborg, Wall Street
>>>>>> Journal, 3 June 2025 issue, page A13.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Here is a gift link.  No paywall, but they will insist on trying to
>>>>>> persuade you to subscribe.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> .<https://www.wsj.com/opinion/the-physics-behind-the-spanish- 
>>>>>> blackout-solar-and-wind-power-unstable-grid-8be54b2a? 
>>>>>> st=VUVUMR&reflink=desktopwebshare_permalink>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Joe
>>>>>
>>>>> What's net zero is the line voltage. The issue is partly spinning
>>>>> mass, but more important is gross gigawatts available on bad
>>>>> afternoons.
>>>>>
>>>>> Another time bomb is that (cheap) solar panels and inverters and
>>>>> batteries don't last as long as is assumed in payback calculations. In
>>>>> 10 or 15 years there will be an enormous disposal problem. And lots of
>>>>> leaky roofs.
>>>>
>>>> Yep.  And given the likely end of the mandates and subsidies,
>>>> replacement may prove expensive, making the business case less
>>>> attractive.
>>>>
>>>> Joe
>>>
>>> I remember not too long ago when the climate-change deniers were 
>>> claiming renewables could never be a significant part of a country's 
>>> energy profile but I guess when they find out Spain was running 73% 
>>> one afternoon they have to change their argument, lol.
>>>
>>> Just goalpost-shifting forever.
>>>
>>> Better question is will the fission nuclear industry ever give up 
>>> trying to push their obsolete pointless technology that has been 
>>> nothing but broken promises for 75 years. It's over give up, already.
>> 
>> Fission works fine, although admittedly it's getting bogged down by
>> regulations and its reputation has suffered from some extensively
>> publicized accidents. Nuclear hasn't caused even close to as many
>> fatalities as has coal. France runs on nuclear power and it's doing
>> fine.
>> 
>> It's fusion that has failed to live up to its promises.
>> 
>> Renewables can be made to work, but need to learn to play well in
>> the existing infrastructure and need some kind of backup which
>> makes it more expensive.
>> 
>> Jeroen Belleman
>> 
>
><https://www.lemonde.fr/en/environment/article/2023/03/26/how-much-water-do-french-nuclear-plants-use_6020697_114.html>
>
>Some global-warming denialists seem to have come around to the idea of 
>"Well it's happening, but it doesn't matter" but how fresh water 
>resources will go _up_ with less and less snowfall and less and less 
>snowpack every year is anyone's guess.
>
>It works "fine" if one buys the BS that other than the lil waste problem 
>it's earth-friendly low-impact technology. It isn't it's hugely 
>water-hungry, and uranium mining only gets dirtier the more of it you 
>extract.

The real tragedy (for some people) is that things keep getting better.

Sorry.