Path: nntp.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: wij <wyniijj5@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.ai.philosophy
Subject: Re: Four Chatbots figure out on their own without prompting that
 HHH(DDD)==0
Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 03:58:41 +0800
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 58
Message-ID: <63850985da8562ba82cabc0579d1743bc8f83b24.camel@gmail.com>
References: <105bdps$1g61u$1@dont-email.me> <105c0lk$1k7ip$1@dont-email.me>
	 <105c22v$1k9r9$3@dont-email.me> <105c5rt$1l4j7$1@dont-email.me>
	 <105cddu$1r7mi$1@dont-email.me>
	 <35481692c9b805cd713086659451ee8a456d3d16@i2pn2.org>
	 <105gase$2pk90$3@dont-email.me>
	 <4750857dbcb68380c00c2cc2752cf3371ef6ae02@i2pn2.org>
	 <105gr3s$2t8jc$1@dont-email.me>
	 <76de7d874ac75cb915c86b297191c6ed4fbedfdf.camel@gmail.com>
	 <105gsoi$2tpa1$1@dont-email.me>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Injection-Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2025 19:58:42 +0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="eabeac0669f23acf6cbdc7d58d3ba27b";
	logging-data="2658218"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";	posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/JmDiZu0ToCUBqsckrQ3Xl"
User-Agent: Evolution 3.56.2 (3.56.2-1.fc42)
Cancel-Lock: sha1:ukNyhR56yRNfUuOGSylE3pt5sdo=
In-Reply-To: <105gsoi$2tpa1$1@dont-email.me>

On Sat, 2025-07-19 at 14:47 -0500, olcott wrote:
> On 7/19/2025 2:29 PM, wij wrote:
> > On Sat, 2025-07-19 at 14:19 -0500, olcott wrote:
> > > On 7/19/2025 12:02 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
> > > > On 7/19/25 10:42 AM, olcott wrote:
> > > > > On 7/18/2025 3:49 AM, joes wrote:
> > > > >=20
> > > > > > That is wrong. It is, as you say, very obvious that HHH cannot =
simulate
> > > > > > DDD past the call to HHH. You just draw the wrong conclusion fr=
om it.
> > > > > > (Aside: what "seems" to you will convince no one. You can just =
call
> > > > > > everybody dishonest. Also, they are not "your reviewers".)
> > > > > >=20
> > > > >=20
> > > > > For the purposes of this discussion this is the
> > > > > 100% complete definition of HHH. It is the exact
> > > > > same one that I give to all the chat bots.
> > > > >=20
> > > > > Termination Analyzer HHH simulates its input until
> > > > > it detects a non-terminating behavior pattern. When
> > > > > HHH detects such a pattern it aborts its simulation
> > > > > and returns 0.
> > > >=20
> > > > So, the only HHH that meets your definition is the HHH that never
> > > > detects the pattern and aborts, and thus never returns.
> > > >=20
> > >=20
> > > All of the Chat bots conclude that HHH(DDD) is correct
> > > to reject its input as non-halting because this input
> > > specified recursive simulation. They figure this out
> > > on their own without any prompting.
> > >=20
> > > https://chatgpt.com/share/687aa4c2-b814-8011-9e7d-b85c03b291eb
> >=20
> > It is still nothing to do with the Halting Problem proof (Because it is=
 POOH)
> >=20
>=20
> It is a key element of my refutation of this proof
> because HHH also correctly determines that HHH(DD)=3D=3D0.
>=20
> DD correctly simulated by HHH cannot possibly ever
> reach past its first statement because it specifies
> recursive simulation.
>=20
> int DD()
> {
> =C2=A0=C2=A0 int Halt_Status =3D HHH(DD);
> =C2=A0=C2=A0 if (Halt_Status)
> =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 HERE: goto HERE;
> =C2=A0=C2=A0 return Halt_Status;
> }
>=20

Boring. HHH cannot do what the HP says.