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From: will.dockery@gmail.com (W.Dockery)
Newsgroups: alt.arts.poetry.comments,rec.arts.poems
Subject: Re: The Lime sock on Stephan Pickering and NAMBLA
Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2025 23:09:25 +0000
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On Sat, 22 Feb 2025 14:00:46 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 22 Feb 2025 2:09:47 +0000, HarryLime wrote:
>>
>>> Will Dockery wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Fri, 21 Feb 2025 22:40:46 +0000, HarryLime wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, 21 Feb 2025 11:21:42 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 16:15:27 +0000, Michael Monkey Peabrain (MPP) aka
>>>>>> "HarryLime" wrote:
>>>>>>> On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 13:06:00 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> snip
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> At some point Jim and Pickles got into a flamewar regarding Ginsberg.  I
>>>>>>>>> don't recall who started it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Well, allow me to refresh your memory. Jim and Stephan first got into
>>>>>>>> flamewars after you formed Team Monkey with him and NastyGoon (NG), a
>>>>>>>> Pickering troll.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You're opening sentence is a delusional lie, George.  I never formed any
>>>>>>> team.  There was no "Team Monkey."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I was on a friendly basis with Jim from the first time he posted here
>>>>>>> (that is to say, the first time after my having joined the group).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Everyone was on a friendly basis with him originally; he mostly posted
>>>>>> his own poetry; mostly the same dozen or less poems that we'd all read,
>>>>>> with the titles constantly changing so we'd read them again, but no one
>>>>>> flamed him for that. If he got into a flamewar with Stephan over
>>>>>> Ginsberg (and I'll accept your claim that that came first), that would
>>>>>> have been his first flamewar. But when he got into his flamewar with
>>>>>> Stephan (possibly  because he was upset that Stephan had been "impolite"
>>>>>> to him), and because you were also upset that Stephan had been
>>>>>> "impolite" to you), the two of you began to flame Stephan together. You
>>>>>> went from having a friendly relationship to forming a troll alliance.
>>>>>
>>>>> Wrong.
>>>>>
>>>>> We remained in a friendly relationship.
>>>>>
>>>>> Fighting Pickles did not affect this in any way.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> When NancyGene first came to the group, she was trolling Pickles -- and
>>>>>>> since Pickles was your Donkey's ally, she soon joined Brooke, ME, Usenet
>>>>>>> Editor, and friends in attacking the Donkey. Since I was also an ally
>>>>>>> of your Donkey, I joined the Donkey in attacking them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So "Dr." NastyGoon (who was trolling and flaming Stephan) formed an
>>>>>> alliance with mini-ME (who was trolling and flaming Will) to troll and
>>>>>> flame both of them; and because you and your Chimp also had an alliance
>>>>>> to troll and flame Stephan, the four of you formed an alliance to troll
>>>>>> and flame both of of them. That's the genesis of "Team Monkey" in a
>>>>>> nutshell.
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you have any idea how batshit crazy half-witted that sounds?
>>>>>
>>>>> Don't answer, the question was rhetorical.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> When they showed that they were willing to work with me in establishing
>>>>>>> peace at AAPC, I stopped fighting with them.  Stopping fights is the
>>>>>>> first step to establishing peace.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But, as you've just told us, you didn't establish any peace or stopping
>>>>>> any fights.
>>>>>
>>>>> Lie!  I just told you that I stopped fighting with NancyGene and ME.
>>>>>
>>>>> How dense are you?
>>>>>
>>>>> *Again, the above question is rhetorical.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> You just switched from (allegedly) attacking them to
>>>>>> attacking Will and Stephan - you formed the troll alliance alliance that
>>>>>> I later called "Team Monkey". To continue:
>>>>>
>>>>> Lie!
>>>>>
>>>>> I did not start attacking Will at that time.  I merely stopped attacking
>>>>> NancyGene and ME on his behalf (a fact which he whined about endlessly).
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The first thing you did was invite NG into Jim's Sunday Sampler,
>>>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>> they (NG's preferred pronoun) would write trollpoems about Stephan. The
>>>>>>>> result would be Stephan jumping into the Sampler, which would result in
>>>>>>>> JIm
>>>>>>>> flaming him and others (for example, Richard Oakley) also being turned
>>>>>>>> against Jim. I doubt that either Jim nor STephan realized that you were
>>>>>>>> manipulating them for that outcome.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Eventually I came to like and respect
>>>>>>> NancyGene and ME, and we became friends.  This was a nature progression
>>>>>>> of our engaging in friendly poetry-related discussions together -- and
>>>>>>> had nothing to do with having created some made up "Team."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You became allies (or, to use your term, online "friends") with two
>>>>>> trolls and the four of you then began trolling and flaming Will and
>>>>>> Stephan. You just don't like my calling your alliance "Team Monkey."
>>>>
>>>> I'll reply in depth when I get to your post, George, but that's correct.
>>>>
>>>>> I did not start trolling Will until after the *second* time he seconded
>>>>> Pickles' post/poem depicting me as a "paedophile."
>>>>
>>>> Again, the poem never seemed to be "about you" Harry, that's just the
>>>> way you decided to interpret the poem.
>>>
>>> Pickles used the name "PaedoScarlotti" in the poem!  How is that a
>>> matter of interpretation?
>>>
>>>
>>>>> This was two years after NancyGene, ME, Jim and I became friends.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> You might also recall that I was *not* attacking the Donkey at that
>>>>>>> time.  Rather than having formed an anti-Donkey team, I had taken a
>>>>>>> neutral position and adopted a friendly stance toward both sides.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Of course it's better for a team to attack one person at a time; but of
>>>>>> course you had to start trolling and flaming Will, since
>>>>>> "Dr." NastyGoon and mini-ME were already trolling him as well.
>>>>>
>>>>> See above.
>>>>>
>>>>> Will and I had been maintaining an uneasy state of civility towards one
>>>>> another, out of respect for our former friendship.
>>>>>
>>>>> It was only after Will seconded Pickles' "paedophile" accusation --
>>>>
>>>> It was simply a poem, not an accusation.
>>>
>>> If I had written dozens of posts accusing you of being a "paedophile,"
>>> addressed you as "PaedoDockery," then wrote a poem about "PaedoDockery"
>>> would it simply be a poem?
>>>
>>>
>>>>> The first time this happened, Will claimed that he had been applauding
>>>>> Pickles' poem in general -- agreeing with its content
>>>>
>>>> The poems didn't really seem to be about you, Harry.
>>>>
>>>> I think you were being a bit paranoid and delusional at that time.
>>>
>>> And I think that you're not so stupid as not to realize that the act of
>>> calling me "PaedoScarlotti" is an implicit accusation that I am a
>>> paedophile.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> began openly opposing my attempts to establish peace.
>>>>
>>>> Completely untrue, I stated to the end that I was in favor of peace and
>>>> that we could have peace immediately by simply stopping the fighting.
>>>
>>> You wanted us to stop attacking you, but refused to stop flooding the
>>> newsgroup with your 50+ slurp posts and "Hello Jordy" posts a day in
>>> return.
>>>
>>> To put it more bluntly, you were saying the equivalent of: "I'll do
>>> whatever I damn well please.  If you don't like it, just skip and
>>> ignore."
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Michael Pendragon showed over and over that he didn't really have any
>>>> interest in peace.
>>>
>>> I was willing to make compromises and concessions.  You were not.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>> Once again, your trolling and flaming were doing nothing to "establish
>>>>>> peace" on the group. In fact, by bringing the flamewars into your
>>>>>> Chimp's Sunday Sampler, you had destroyed the one oasis of peace.
>>>>
>>>> The troll thugs were determined to drive Stephan Pickering from the
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