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From: mpsilvertone@yahoo.com (HarryLime)
Newsgroups: alt.arts.poetry.comments,rec.arts.poems
Subject: Re: The Lime sock on Stephan Pickering and NAMBLA
Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2025 00:37:54 +0000
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On Sun, 23 Feb 2025 0:25:52 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

> On Sat, 22 Feb 2025 23:49:17 +0000, HarryLime wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 22 Feb 2025 15:36:43 +0000, Will Dockery wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 16 Feb 2025 7:06:42 +0000, HarryLime wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sun, 16 Feb 2025 3:37:09 +0000, Will Dockery wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I am publishing an AAPC poetry journal featuring award-winning poets.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Can you say vanity press?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A vanity press charges a "reading" or "submission" fee.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Do you pay in contributors copies?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Almost.  I don't receive any money for them.  They're sold at cost.
>>>
>>> So, like I said, your publication is basically vanity press, poets
>>> published in your book have to pay to see a copy of the book their
>>> poetry is published in.
>>>
>>> Good luck with your vanity press venture.
>>
>> Wrong, Donkey. Very few small press publications provide comp copies for
>> payment these days.  Indie press has undergone a great many changes
>> since the 1980s.  There aren't any Xexored, stapled "zines" anymore.
>>
>> The small press is now either an e-zine or print-on-demand.  And I've
>> yet to see a free print-on-demand comp copy.
>>
>> "AYoS" is both a free monthly e-zine and an annual print-on-demand that
>> is sold at cost.  The annual publication (a paperback book) is a "year's
>> best" collection.  The monthly e-zine is no different from any other
>> e-zine.
>>
>>
>>>>> So... no.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> After Jim and Stephan became engaged in a prolonged flamewar
>>>
>>> Eventually dragging everyone in.
>>
>> So, people get dragged in to flame wars.  That's all part of the many
>> joys of Usenet (sarcasm alert).
>>
>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> off the Sampler, the second thing you did was start flooding the group
>>>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>>>>> a nasty, libellous document that NG had written.
>>>
>>> Lest we forget ^^^
>>
>> We already have.
>>
>> I certainly saw no such "document."
>>
>> Please be so good as to explain WTF you're prattling on about.
>>
>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>> Oh yes, the last resort, flood the newsgroup with your lies and
>>>>>>>>> misrepresentations.
>>>
>>> Exactly, nailed it.
>>
>> Nonsense.
>>
>> I suggest you look at the list of threads currently at the top of the
>> feed and count the number that were actually started by me. [HINT: 0]
>>
>> Then count the number started by you, Jordy, or Dance.
>>
>> You might also want to take note of how many of these threads are
>> sporting titles like "NastyGoon Lifts a Line" or "The Lime sock on
>> Stephan Pickering and NAMBLA."
>>
>> If anyone is flooding the newsgroup with lies and misrepresentations
>> it's George Dance.
>>
>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> There was no such "libellous[sic]" document
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> George Dance saw it differently.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> He certainly spelled it differently.
>>>
>>> George Dance got his point across, spelling lames notwithstanding.
>>
>> No, Donkey, he didn't.  His thread was titled "NastyGoon Lifts a Line."
>> No matter how much he may backpedal as to whether or not he technically
>> accused her of plagiarism in the body of the post [HINT: He did.], the
>> thread's title should remove any and all doubt as to his intention.
>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Grim times for the poetry newsgroup indeed.
>>>>
>>>>>>>>> There's no guidelines on who we "allow" to be here on a Usenet
>>>>>>>>> newsgroup.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Stephan Pickering knew poetry and made many good poetry posts.
>>>>
>>>>>>> Pretty good poetry, as I recall.
>>>>>>> Stephan Pickering has written some interesting poems over the years.
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The third thing you did, a month or so of that, when Jim and Stephan
>>>>>>>>>>>> were thoroughly
>>>>>>>>>>>> engaged with each other, you went deep diving outside the group for
>>>>>>>>>>>> information on NAMBLA, and found a quotation from Allan Ginsberg
>>>>>>>>>>>> ("I have never had sex with anyone under 15"
>>>
>>> Under 18-19, we now know.
>>
>> Again, Donkey, I have provided you with links that state otherwise.  You
>> can believe what you want to, but there is a great deal of evidence to
>> the contrary.
>>
>>>
>>>>>>> The youngest sex partner Allen Ginsberg is known to have was the 18-19
>>>>>>> year old man
>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And later it turns out the youngest sex partner Allen Ginsberg is known
>>>>>>>>> to have was an 18-19 year old man.
>>>>
>>>>> He was 18 and then turned 19.
>>>>> Unless something new has surfaced, there's zero evidence.
>>>>
>>>> IIRC, Ginsberg tacitly admitted it in one or more interviews.
>>>>
>>>>>>> There's an interview with the fellow, I don't remember his name right
>>>>>>> now.
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> posting here, falsely calling Ginsberg a "pedophile" (or predator);
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Which, from the evidence, wasn't true, as shown above.
>>>>>
>>>>> Again, more on this later.
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>  and then
>>>>>>>>>>>> when others objected to that (like Stephan, Will, or myself), you began
>>>>>>>>>>>> calling those people "pedophiles" as well.
>>>
>>> Harry/Pendragon has apparently forgotten that he began this line of name
>>> calling.
>>
>> Lie.
>>
>> Pickles *said* that he'd statutorily raped two 14-year old girls.
>> Pickles said that there should be *no* legal age restrictions.  Pickles
>> said that the only reason he wouldn't recommend having a sexual
>> relationship with someone under the age of thirteen was because younger
>> children are unable to commit to a long term relationship and *the
>> adult* would end up getting hurt.  Pickles said that incest is
>> culturally accepted in many countries and that those of us who are
>> opposed to it have been duped by "Nazrim paradigms."  Pickles said that
>> he went to NAMBLA meetings, NAMBLA conventions, and took NAMBLA members
>> to dinner.
>>
>> In light of the above, my labeling Pickles a "pedophile" was not a
>> matter of "name calling."  It was a matter of *fact* based on Pickles'
>> own admissions.
>>
>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>> That's when the bullshit from Pendragon began to get heavy.
>>>
>>> And hot progressively worse.
>>
>> Lie.
>>
>> There is no accusation one can make that is worse than that of
>> "pedophile."  Pickles was one by his own accounting.  Pickles called me
>> one (playing George's game of Tit for Tat).
>>
>> The only acceleration in the flame war came upon the discovery of the
>> Ackerman letters which proved that Pickles' entire life story (as he'd
>> told it) had been a lie.
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