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From: Wolfgang Agnes <wagnes@example.com>
Newsgroups: comp.misc
Subject: Re: [LINK] Mozilla Foundation lays off 30% staff, drops advocacy division
Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2024 10:10:49 -0300
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Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> writes:

> Wolfgang Agnes <wagnes@jemoni.to> wrote:
>> Same here.  I view the situation as a major sign of failure.  It seems
>> the whole world is on the same boat, though.  I don't know of any
>> company that has not bought into all this nonsense---they may exist (and
>> I hope they do), but surely I don't know the routine of every company
>> out there.  ``Software engineering'' in the universities are also going
>> in the same direction.  In fact, one thing I observe in the universities
>> is that the academics in ``software engineering'' are actually the
>> manager-types who are not (at the same time) programmers, which is a
>> terrible sign.  I hope I'm not offending anyone, but it's really how I
>> think.
>
> Academics (as in the people called 'Professor') are actually doing day to
> day management of X number of students/postdocs/etc, as well as writing
> grants, writing papers, teaching, admin, etc.  Which doesn't leave a lot of
> time for programming.  It's the students/postdocs/etc who are actually doing
> the programming, so the professor is at best at one remove.  They may have
> been programmers in the recent/distant past, but eventually all that extra
> stuff crowds out the programming.

They don't really like to do the programming.  If they did, they
wouldn't leave it all up to students.

  [T]he impact of this new approach on my own style has been
  profound, and my excitement has continued unabated for more than two
  years.  I enjoy the new methodology so much that it is hard for me
  to refrain from going back to every program that I've ever written
  and recasting it in `literate' form.  I find myself unable to resist
  working on programming tasks that I would ordinarily have assigned
  to student research assistants; and why?  Because it seems to me
  that at last I'm able to write programs as they should be written.
  My programs are not only explained better than ever before; they
  also are better programs, because the new methodology encourages me
  to do a better job.

  --- Donald Knuth, ``Literate programming.''
  The Computer Journal 27.2, 1984: páginas 97--111.

>> We also live a certain overconfidence in science.  There are very few
>> scientists doing relevant work, but there's a widespread belief that
>> science (and technology) will always solve everything---it's always just
>> a matter of time; someone will figure it out.  Ask people and you will
>> see---almost nobody understands anything about quantum computing or
>> artificial intelligence, but nearly everyone thinks that it's a matter
>> of a short time and all the quantum computing will be here for the next
>> revolution.  And I need say nothing about artificial intelligence
>> because everyone is well-aware about the all the hype.
>
> I think that's 'tech', not 'science'.  'Science' is the study of the world -
> I don't think we're overconfident about gravity, but techbros may be
> overconfident about quantum computing.  They certainly are about AI.

Precisely.

>> On the other hand, though, I totally understand the fears: academics are
>> fearful of not having anything to say and managers either invent
>> something whatever or they have a nervous breakdown out of fear of
>> losing their jobs.  And some really do.  They have a deep sense of
>> incapacity: it seems they never find a way to put their lives to good
>> use.  It's a very sorry situation.
>
> I think it's the problem a lot of organisations have that once you get
> into the higher tiers you get further away from actually doing stuff, and
> perhaps lose touch with how it is done.

That's one way to look at it.  What I really see is that people get
tired.  They lose health---feel tired---, blame it on the age---``we're
getting old''---and so on.  Programming is a heavy activity.  If we
don't stay healthy, we'll lose the energy necessary to tackle it.