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From: Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: The philosophy of computation reformulates existing ideas on a
 new basis ---Breakthrough ?
Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2024 21:11:32 -0500
Organization: i2pn2 (i2pn.org)
Message-ID: <9bfbb901e8e3c8f091203e8bb75a56e7e5dc5407@i2pn2.org>
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On 11/9/24 9:01 PM, olcott wrote:
> On 11/9/2024 7:59 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>> On 11/9/24 8:28 PM, olcott wrote:
>>> On 11/9/2024 6:19 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>> On 11/9/24 6:43 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>> On 11/9/2024 2:56 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>>>> On 11/9/24 3:01 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On 11/3/2024 12:20 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>>>  > On 11/3/24 9:39 AM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>  >>
>>>>>  >> The finite string input to HHH specifies that HHH
>>>>>  >> MUST EMULATE ITSELF emulating DDD.
>>>>>  >
>>>>>  > Right, and it must CORRECTLY determine what an unbounded
>>>>>  > emulation of that input would do, even if its own programming
>>>>>  > only lets it emulate a part of that.
>>>>>  >
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I am saying that HHH does need to do the infinite emulation 
>>>>>>>> itself, but 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Right and it doesn't.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But doesn't give the required answer, which is based on something 
>>>>>> doing it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The unaborted emulation of DDD by HHH DOES NOT HALT.
>>>>> *Maybe I have to dumb it down some more*
>>>>
>>>> But that isn't the HHH that you are talking about.
>>>>
>>>> It seems, you don't understand that in a given evaluation, HHH and 
>>>> DDD are FIXED PROGRAM.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> HHH predicts what would happen if no HHH ever aborted
>>>>> its emulation of DDD. This specific DDD never halts
>>>>> even if it stops running due to out-of-memory error.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> In other words, it tries to predict what some OTHER version of the 
>>>> program DDD would do if it was based on some OTHER version of HHH, 
>>>
>>> *Yes just like you agreed that it should*
>>>
>>> On 11/3/2024 12:20 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>  > Right, and it must CORRECTLY determine what an unbounded
>>>  > emulation of that input would do,
>>>  > even if its own programming only lets it emulate a part of that.
>>>
>>
>> Nope, never said it could immulate some OTHER input, or predict what 
>> some OTHER program does.
>>
> 
> You said that the bounded HHH
>  > must CORRECTLY determine what an unbounded
>  > emulation of that input would do,
> 

Right, the UNBOUNDED EMULATION, not the results of a different DDD that 
called an HHH that did an unbounded emulation.

The input doesn't change, and the input specifies the HHH that DDD 
calls. so that doesn't change.