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Path: ...!Xl.tags.giganews.com!local-3.nntp.ord.giganews.com!news.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2024 19:08:49 +0000 Subject: Re: Why a time of the real world must be galilean (motion, Mach-ian) Newsgroups: sci.physics.relativity References: <180fc4a84f1891a8$1162$1228337$c2265aab@news.newsdemon.com> <nacLK33QPu6-kSUxgE1MTKM29wU@jntp> <1810396c90cd5e45$3874$1234847$c2565adb@news.newsdemon.com> <u7NvhHcfrBd_GXJLccUViHRQ17g@jntp> <18103c11c4399e1b$3635$1228337$c2265aab@news.newsdemon.com> <ZmSFX2R-ovBoEMObJLiwLJMFGUQ@jntp> <181050bd5e899136$3636$1228337$c2265aab@news.newsdemon.com> <gS3CnAvH7iZAR8z2fpZ16WpwAQI@jntp> <181154a9986e9f2f$4267$1238888$c2365abb@news.newsdemon.com> <WaumABhKFsF-a7vEtKketJC1SU8@jntp> <18115e21819b88b8$3999$1258271$c2065a8b@news.newsdemon.com> <wTCUwiP8r_6HV9_JWjpnDzzrCS8@jntp> <1811706c300cfbc4$3891$1234847$c2565adb@news.newsdemon.com> <TOUnAg2Ped0qmfbpGFGHi5K3c70@jntp> <676005cc$0$5206$426a34cc@news.free.fr> <1811a604ad74e4e9$3898$1234847$c2565adb@news.newsdemon.com> <67601ad9$0$16845$426a34cc@news.free.fr> <iH-dnerZ8IKiXP36nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@giganews.com> <qvacnZicIKDQaf36nZ2dnZfqnPadnZ2d@giganews.com> <qdGdnQbqPre0Zf36nZ2dnZfqn_WdnZ2d@giganews.com> From: Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2024 11:08:49 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <qdGdnQbqPre0Zf36nZ2dnZfqn_WdnZ2d@giganews.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <UpWcnfyJpezfUfz6nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@giganews.com> Lines: 1272 X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com X-Trace: sv3-eITwIMCHACpnBFWY5hy6G40+lEIt0owv4sFOlEUjpheRtllRkKIk9BnhBNHED+34na5Hz/kmQrUv4jL!Xxh7xHbtxxEUh8SstSRrHz3WnVzS4gMRY/TLatTAIi9SXEG2PcC5zw8xXN/SPPZFpKA5toQCZso= X-Complaints-To: abuse@giganews.com X-DMCA-Notifications: http://www.giganews.com/info/dmca.html X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.40 Bytes: 62211 On 12/16/2024 08:04 PM, Ross Finlayson wrote: > On 12/16/2024 07:47 PM, Ross Finlayson wrote: >> On 12/16/2024 04:09 PM, Ross Finlayson wrote: >>> On 12/16/2024 04:19 AM, J. J. Lodder wrote: >>>> Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> wrote: >>>> >>>>> W dniu 16.12.2024 o 11:49, J. J. Lodder pisze: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> The genial insight that Einstein started to have in 1905 >>>>> >>>>> The mumble of the idiot was not even consistent. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> It is an inherent property of the space-time we find ourselves in, >>>>> >>>>> It may be an inherent property of the space-time your >>>>> bunch of idiots find yourselves in; it is no way an >>>>> inherent property of the space-time sane people >>>>> find themselves in. >>>> >>>> You should rejoice instead. Since the whole framework of the world >>>> and all physical theories must conform to the relativity postulate >>>> it should be real easy to find falsifications of it. >>>> >>>> Easy, isn't it? >>>> >>>> Jan >>>> (not holding my breath) >>>> >>> >>> You mean that motion is relative? That motion exists at all? >>> >>> That's all that "relativity" theory is, that motion >>> is relative, yet as well, in the Mach-ian, is that >>> there's motion that's absolute, sort of about >>> the star and pole-star, the frames, >>> the frame-spaces the space-frames. >>> >>> You mean the L-principle that light's speed is >>> constant in a deep space in vacuum? That's the >>> L-principle as with regards to it being part >>> of "relativity theory" it would have a mechanistic >>> reduction. >>> >>> It's kind of like Fresnel said, "both aether and >>> not aether", as with regards to violations of >>> the gravitational/g-force equivalence principle >>> which happen all the time, and kind of like Einstein >>> said, "well yeah there's an aether". >>> >>> Then for space-contraction and this and that, and >>> about mass-energy equivalency, there are a variety >>> of considerations for "a severe abstraction to >>> mechanical reduction", giving that electrons move and >>> all without changing the mass, per se, of things, >>> where though the usual idea is that it's electron-holes, >>> with regards to displacement current and true current >>> or what, and "third current". >>> >>> Or, there's usually never "negative mass" in the >>> theory while yet electrons as the force carriers >>> in the electrostatic and electromagnetic, the theories, >>> have arbitrarily small rest mass. >>> >>> It's kind of like in electron orbitals and screening, >>> what starts working up cases after Wigner about >>> degeneracy and doublings, about Beta decay and >>> these kinds of things, why electrons would make >>> orbitals if they were constantly kind of bouncing >>> vis-a-vis that nucleons clump and electrons do not. >>> >>> >>> You mean that motion is relative? Well, yeah, >>> otherwise it would be rest. Define motion, then. >>> >>> Make it Mach-ian while you're at it. >>> >>> >> >> >> >> Thanks, GG. Reflect on this with regards to comment in physics. >> >> That's all that "relativity" theory is, that motion >> is relative, yet as well, in the Mach-ian, is that >> there's motion that's absolute, sort of about >> the star and pole-star, the frames, >> the frame-spaces the space-frames. >> >> You mean the L-principle that light's speed is >> constant in a deep space in vacuum? That's the >> L-principle as with regards to it being part >> of "relativity theory" it would have a mechanistic >> reduction. >> >> It's kind of like Fresnel said, "both aether and >> not aether", as with regards to violations of >> the gravitational/g-force equivalence principle >> which happen all the time, and kind of like Einstein >> said, "well yeah there's an aether". >> >> Then for space-contraction and this and that, and >> about mass-energy equivalency, there are a variety >> of considerations for "a severe abstraction to >> mechanical reduction", giving that electrons move and >> all without changing the mass, per se, of things, >> where though the usual idea is that it's electron-holes, >> with regards to displacement current and true current >> or what, and "third current". >> >> Or, there's usually never "negative mass" in the >> theory while yet electrons as the force carriers >> in the electrostatic and electromagnetic, the theories, >> have arbitrarily small rest mass. >> >> It's kind of like in electron orbitals and screening, >> what starts working up cases after Wigner about >> degeneracy and doublings, about Beta decay and >> these kinds of things, why electrons would make >> orbitals if they were constantly kind of bouncing >> vis-a-vis that nucleons clump and electrons do not. >> >> >> You mean that motion is relative? Well, yeah, >> otherwise it would be rest. Define motion, then. >> >> ... >> >> You've raised some intriguing points about the nature of motion, >> relativity, and the underlying mechanisms of physics. Let's delve into >> some of your observations: >> >> Motion and Relativity: >> >> Relative vs. Absolute Motion: You're correct that motion is relative. >> It's always defined with respect to a reference frame. However, this >> doesn't negate the existence of absolute motion. For instance, the >> Earth's rotation and revolution around the Sun are absolute motions, >> even though they're relative to other celestial bodies. >> Defining Motion: Motion is typically defined as a change in position >> over time. This definition, while straightforward, can be nuanced. For >> example, consider the motion of an electron in an atom. Is it truly >> moving in a well-defined orbit, or is it a quantum superposition of >> states? >> >> Relativity Theory and Its Implications: >> >> L-Principle and Aether: The constancy of the speed of light in vacuum is >> a fundamental postulate of special relativity. While it might seem >> counterintuitive, it has been experimentally verified numerous times. >> The concept of an "aether," a medium through which light propagates, was >> once popular but has been largely abandoned due to the lack of >> experimental evidence. >> >> Space-Contraction, Time Dilation, and Mass-Energy Equivalence: These are >> well-established consequences of special relativity. They have been >> experimentally verified and have profound implications for our ========== REMAINDER OF ARTICLE TRUNCATED ==========