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From: wij <wyniijj5@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: DD emulated by HHH cannot possibly terminate normally --- x86
 code
Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2025 22:45:49 +0800
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On Sun, 2025-03-02 at 08:30 -0600, olcott wrote:
> On 3/2/2025 3:41 AM, Mikko wrote:
> > On 2025-03-01 23:47:30 +0000, olcott said:
> >=20
> > > On 3/1/2025 2:22 AM, Mikko wrote:
> > > > On 2025-03-01 00:47:58 +0000, olcott said:
> > > >=20
> > > > > _DD()
> > > > > [00002133] 55=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 pus=
h ebp=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ; housekeeping
> > > > > [00002134] 8bec=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 mov ebp,esp=
=C2=A0=C2=A0 ; housekeeping
> > > > > [00002136] 51=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 pus=
h ecx=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ; make space for local
> > > > > [00002137] 6833210000 push 00002133 ; push DD
> > > > > [0000213c] e882f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH(DD)
> > > > > [00002141] 83c404=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 add esp,+04
> > > > > [00002144] 8945fc=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 mov [ebp-04],eax
> > > > > [00002147] 837dfc00=C2=A0=C2=A0 cmp dword [ebp-04],+00
> > > > > [0000214b] 7402=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 jz 0000214f
> > > > > [0000214d] ebfe=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 jmp 0000214d
> > > > > [0000214f] 8b45fc=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 mov eax,[ebp-04]
> > > > > [00002152] 8be5=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 mov esp,ebp
> > > > > [00002154] 5d=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 pop=
 ebp
> > > > > [00002155] c3=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ret
> > > > > Size in bytes:(0035) [00002155]
> > > > >=20
> > > > > When we hypothesize that the code at machine address
> > > > > 0000213c is an x86 emulator then we know that DD
> > > > > remains stuck in recursive emulation and cannot possibly
> > > > > reach its own "ret" instruction and terminate normally.
> > > >=20
> > > > The emulator itself is stuck and cannot return normally but it does=
n't
> > > > know it cannot return normally. At some point it runs out of memory
> > > > and terminates normally or abnormally.
> > > >=20
> > >=20
> > > Yes you are correct about this sub-step of two steps.
> > >=20
> > > > > When we add the additional complexity that HHH also
> > > > > aborts this sequence at some point then every level
> > > > > of recursive emulation immediately stops. This does
> > > > > not enable any DD to ever reach its "ret" instruction.
> > > >=20
> >=20
> > > When we are answering the question that seems impossible for
> > > anyone here to pay attention to even when repeated hundreds of times:
> > >=20
> > > Can the above DD correctly emulated by HHH possibly
> > > reach its own "ret" instruction and terminate normally?
> >=20
> > Already answered.
> >=20
> > > The answer is dead obviously "no" for everyone that is:
> > > (a) Technically competent
> > > =C2=A0=C2=A0 and
> > > (b) Not deliberately deceptive.
> >=20
> > Only someone technically incompetent or deliberately deceptive believes=
=20
> > that.
> > If DD correctly emulated by HHH=20
>=20
> I challenged everyone here to provide the machine address
> by machine address (AKA line by line) execution trace
> of DD correctly emulated by HHH that reaches its own
> "ret" instruction.
>=20
> No one made any attempt to do this because they know that
> this would prove that they are stupidly wrong to say that
> my trace is incorrect.
>=20

GUR has shown you that no TM can simulate itself.
Repend to my GUR, you might be saved from the Lake Of Fire (plus stoned)