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From: Vincent Maycock <maycock@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: talk.origins
Subject: Re: Ool - out at first base?
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2024 10:50:39 -0800
Organization: University of Ediacara
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On Thu, 19 Dec 2024 17:33:39 +1100, MarkE <me22over7@gmail.com> wrote:

>On 19/12/2024 5:17 pm, Vincent Maycock wrote:
>> On Thu, 19 Dec 2024 14:10:27 +1100, MarkE <me22over7@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> [...]
>> 
>>> God is eternally preexisting, nonmaterial, above and beyond time,
>>> matter, energy, but creating and controlling these.
>> 
>> If he's beyond time, on what stage or background does he do anything?
>
>Given we exist in and bound by time, matter, energy, we are by 
>definition not able to comprehend the stage or background of God's 
>existence.

No, humans are quite adept at thinking in the abstract.  Most of
modern mathematics is like that. 

>> 
>>> God conceived of all created things before they came into being.
>> 
>>   How could we test this claim?
>
>Die.

Do you plan on killing yourself to test the claim?  

>>> God spoke and there was...spacetime, matter, energy.
>> 
>> More likely those things have just always existed, the same as this
>> supposed god called God that you're talking about.
>
>How did you calculate that likelihood?

How do you calculate the likelihood that God has always existed? 

>>> God created the initial low entropy state of the universe.
>> 
>> Could it have been the Flying Spaghetti Monster that created this low
>> entropy start for the universe?
>
>You may prefer that hypothesis.

What's preferable about that hypothesis? 

>>> God designed physics, the periodic table, etc, as building blocks
>>> capable of being fashioned into all created things.
>> 
>> What about those useless high-mass elements found further on in the
>> periodic table?
>
>What is your definition of useful, and why is usefulness so defined a 
>criterion?

Usefulness is defined by you right up there -- "capable of being
fashioned into all created things." 

>>> God designed all living things and spoke them into being,
>> 
>> Would it be possible to catch God in the act of speaking things into
>> being?
>
>Too late. "In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth." 
>(Genesis 1:1).

Are you a young earth creationist or an old earth creationist? 

> Though since then he has been seen change water into 
>wine, and raise the dead.

Why didn't anyone outside the Gospels notice these miracles?  And if
he's "been seen" performing those miracles, what would prevent him
from using miracles to add to life's diversity here and now? 

>>> either
>>> directly, or indirectly through innate capacity for change and adaptation.
>> 
>> How does this indirect creation relate to universal common descent of
>> all living things?
>
>I don't have a settled opinion on this.

So you're open to the possibility that all life forms evolved from a
common ancestor?

>> 
>>> Etc.
>> 
>> Like what?
>
>Convince me that this is not the equivalent of the Python Argument 
>Clinic sketch.