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From: Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: Anyone with sufficient knowledge of C knows that DD specifies
 non-terminating behavior to HHH
Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2025 18:05:13 -0500
Organization: i2pn2 (i2pn.org)
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On 2/9/25 2:57 PM, olcott wrote:
> On 2/9/2025 1:42 PM, joes wrote:
>> Am Sun, 09 Feb 2025 13:00:05 -0600 schrieb olcott:
>>> On 2/9/2025 12:47 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>> Op 09.feb.2025 om 17:49 schreef olcott:
>>>>> On 2/9/2025 10:43 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>> Op 09.feb.2025 om 17:37 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>> On 2/9/2025 9:53 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>>> Op 09.feb.2025 om 16:15 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>>>> On 2/9/2025 2:09 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Op 09.feb.2025 om 07:04 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/8/2025 3:49 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Op 08.feb.2025 om 15:43 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/8/2025 3:54 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Op 08.feb.2025 om 00:13 schreef olcott:
>>
>>>>>>>>> The input to HHH(DD) cannot possibly terminate normally. Referring
>>>>>>>>> to some other DD does not change this verfied fact.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That DD halts is a verified fact.
>>>>>>> The input to HHH(DD) DOES NOT HALT !!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is a verified fact that the finite string describes a halting
>>>>>> program. Du to a bug, HHH does not see that, because it investigates
>>>>>> only the first few instructions of DD. HHH is unable to process the
>>>>>> call from DD to HHH correctly.
>>>>>
>>>>> DD simulated by HHH cannot possibly terminate normally.
>>>>
>>>> Indeed, because HHH fails to simulate itself up to the end.
>>>> This is verified with:
>>>>          int main() {
>>>>            return HHH(main);
>>>>          }
>>>>
>>> There is no simulating itself to the end with the above example either.
>>> Apparently you do not understand the basic notion of recursion very
>>> well.
> 
>> That’s the point. HHH doesn’t terminate.
>>
> Counter-factual.
> 

Then it is wrong, as if HHH returns 0, it returns 0 when DD calls it so 
DD will terminate and HHH will just be wrong.

You need to decide if HHH does a correct simulation or is a decider.

It can't be both, as they are mutually exclusive.