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From: Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: The insane progress nobody is talking about
Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2024 08:25:12 -0700
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On Thu, 11 Jul 2024 19:19:44 -0400, William Hyde
<wthyde1953@gmail.com> wrote:

>Paul S Person wrote:
>> On Wed, 10 Jul 2024 20:29:30 -0400, William Hyde
>> <wthyde1953@gmail.com> wrote:
>>=20
>>> The Horny Goat wrote:
>>>> On 27 Jun 2024 22:06:45 -0000, kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) =
wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> My case is a clear no go - there's a commuter rail station about a
>>>>>> mile away, but the Boston commuter system as designed with the
>>>>>> assumption that everyone wanted to go to the city center - my last=
 work
>>>>>> place was about 8 miles out, but NW of town, while I live W of =
town.
>>>>>
>>>>> Boston and DC both have systems built that way, with no rings at =
all, and
>>>>> it is increasingly limiting their usefulness as fewer and fewer =
people are
>>>>> working in the city center.   In the case of Boston the commuter =
rail is
>>>>> actually a lot better than the subway, but the subway is a major =
problem.
>>>>> In the case of DC there is talk about adding some rings in the =
future
>>>>> and there is a good chance of the purple line happening but it's =
really
>>>>> too little and too late.
>>>>> --scott
>>>>
>>>> So does Vancouver - I had to go to the pharmacy yesterday (I'm
>>>> temporarily unable to drive due to recent eye surgery) and had to =
bus
>>>> it and had to take 2 buses - both of which eventually went or had =
come
>>>> from downtown simply to go what is generally a 10-15 minute drive =
for
>>>> me. Given the outside temperature (high 80s / low 90s) I was not
>>>> amused at having a 15-20 minute wait at my transfer point (which was
>>>> far away from the straight line path from home to pharmacy)
>>>>
>>>> It was unnecessarily getting up from the bus stop and walking around
>>>> constantly simply to get some air flow....
>>>
>>> I was preemptively getting  ready to vent some ire at the Toronto
>>> Transit commission today, but the scheming rascals preempted my
>>> preemption by giving me a smooth and timely trip. Some people!
>>>
>>> But yes, bus-to-bus transfers are always a heart attack waiting to =
happen.
>>>
>>> Still, by law I have to complain about something, so I will.  All bus
>>> stops need benches.  If we stopped renaming things to appease the
>>> ill-informed we could use the money for that.
>>=20
>> Provided the transit system owns the rights to the space required.
>> "Owns" here may be literal (leased from a private owner) or, more
>> likely, may mean that the land was designated for their use by the
>> gummint (who owns it). Other complications are possible.
>>=20
>> Anyhoo, a when King County took over Seattle Transit, Seattle paid
>> them for a "free ride zone" downtown. This allowed shoppers and those
>> we now call "the homeless" could ride about as needed for free. This
>> was implemented by collecting the fare (on inbound trips) when the bus
>> was entered and (on outbound trips) when the bus was exited.
>>=20
>> Which meant that, except for downtown, everybody exited and entered
>> (in that order) the bus at the front.
>>=20
>> Which meant that the bus stops outside the ride-free area were not
>> bus-length because they didn't have to be, no doubt saving money and
>> making more spaces available.
>>=20
>> Well, that changed. Everybody paid when the got on. And, except for
>> those who needed the "kneeling bus" feature (available only at the
>> front), everybody got off at the rear. Which could be:
>>=20
>> 1. a shrubbery (with associated tripping hazard)
>> 2. a driveway (adding 3" to the drop from bus to ground)
>> 3. a few inches away (for articulated buses that were swung slightly
>> away from the curb in back, adding inches to the space to be traversed
>> in a single step unless you wanted to step down into the street, a
>> good 3" below the curb)
>>=20
>> The first two, of course, illustrate why some of the new bus stops
>> /had/ to be so short: a stop capable of accomodating a long
>> (articulated) bus -- or in some cases even a short bus -- would not
>> have been practical, particularly if it collided with a driveway.
>
>That's a lot of problems we just don't have.  Possibly due to greater=20
>municipal powers.

To be fair, I don't have then either, as I haven't ridden the bus for
several years. I walk to where I need to go, and then walk back.
Beyond that, there is always shopping online.

>Buses are now accessible by a debit card or, if you wish, a special=20
>transit card.  For two hours after you pay all rides are free.  So=20
>yesterday I could go downtown to BMV bookstore, take he subway  to a=20
>grocery store for items not available here in the hinterland, get a good
>coffee ditto, then take subway and bus back here, all for one fare.

I don't know about debit cards, but I still have my Orca card, labled
"Senior" and so theoretically useful wherever "Seniors" get a
discount. Not that I bother. I have a few bucks loaded on it, just in
case.

I've never tried on the subway (light rail). That is an adventure yet
to happen, most likely when my driver's license next needs renewing. I
keep renewing it even though I don't drive as it is occasionally
useful as "photo id".

>Back in the dim and terrible past of transit zones, that would have been=
=20
>four fares.  Another example of progress!

We had paper transfers. We may /still/ have them, for those who pay
cash. I was surprised when I started using my Orca Card to find that
one fare worked for both the trip out and the trip back; with cash, I
was paying (once, if a transfer was needed) each way.

This is all subsidized, BTW. "Seniors" pay $1 (well, did a few years
ago); kids had a reduced fare; everyone else paid several bucks. But
even that didn't cover the cost. There has been some sporadic talk of
not bothering to charge fares at all, but I don't think we are there
yet. At some level, I suspect, the idea that paying even a small
amount for something is better than getting it for free.
--=20
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"