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From: Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org>
Newsgroups: comp.theory,sci.logic
Subject: Re: Liar detector: Fred, Richard, Joes and Alan --- Ben's agreement
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2024 12:16:06 -0400
Organization: i2pn2 (i2pn.org)
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On 7/5/24 11:54 AM, olcott wrote:
> On 7/5/2024 10:48 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>> Op 05.jul.2024 om 16:05 schreef olcott:
>>> On 7/5/2024 8:54 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>
>>>> HHH cannot possibly correctly simulate itself.
>>>>
>>> LIAR! I give up on you.
>>> https://liarparadox.org/HHH(DDD)_Full_Trace.pdf
>>
>> No need to come back, because you are unable to point to any error in 
>> my reasoning. 
> 
> I conclusively proved that HHH is correctly simulating itself
> simulating DDD and you simply freaking lie about it.

Then why didn't it see that HHH it was simulating returning?

> 
>> Your replies are only irrelevant, or supporting my reasoning. I showed 
>> that HHH cannot possibly simulate itself correctly and your full trace 
>> supports this, as it shows that the simulating HHH is unable to reach 
>> the 'ret' of the simulated HHH.
>>
> 
> *Unable to reach ret IS A FREAKING CORRECT FREAKING SIMULATION*
> The machine code specifies that DDD simulated by HHH according
> to the semantics of the x86 language cannot possibly reach the
> ret instruction of DDD or its correctly simulated self.

Nope. not if you only didn't reach the return because you stoppped 
simulating.

Since the input has a copy of the exact same program as you are, if YOU 
abort your simulation, so does it, and thus you were WRONG to abort.

You aren't the non-aborting program you assume program you assume the 
input is calling, and thus it isn't either.

The source of the problem is you keep on thinking you are actually 
simulating a template, but you can't be, because you had to instantiate 
the template have what you needed to simulate it, so the code of the HHH 
was LOCKED to THIS HHH, and doesn't change when you hypotonsize what 
would happen if your instsnce didn't abort (which you can't actually 
express in your code base except by making a totally different copy of 
HHH, called like HHH1, with the diffrence (if any) and have that 
simulate the code. And if HHH1 does a full simulation, it sees that DDD 
calls HHH which will eventually decider to abort (since that is the 
decision you finally made for your design of HHH) and then HHH return to 
DDD and DDD return and Halt.

> 
> _DDD()
> [00002172] 55               push ebp      ; housekeeping
> [00002173] 8bec             mov ebp,esp   ; housekeeping
> [00002175] 6872210000       push 00002172 ; push DDD
> [0000217a] e853f4ffff       call 000015d2 ; call HHH(DDD)
> [0000217f] 83c404           add esp,+04
> [00002182] 5d               pop ebp
> [00002183] c3               ret
> Size in bytes:(0018) [00002183]
> 
> 

You are just showing your total ignorance of the field you are claiming 
to be making massive discovers in, showing you are actually just stupid.