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From: Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org>
Newsgroups: sci.logic,comp.theory
Subject: Re: Minimal Logics in the 2020's: A Meteoric Rise --- eternal
 september failure
Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2024 20:13:17 -0400
Organization: i2pn2 (i2pn.org)
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On 7/10/24 8:09 PM, olcott wrote:
> On 7/10/2024 7:01 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>> On 7/10/24 9:58 AM, olcott wrote:
>>> On 7/8/2024 7:37 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>> On 7/8/24 8:28 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Every expression of language that cannot be proven
>>>>> or refuted by any finite or infinite sequence of
>>>>> truth preserving operations connecting it to its
>>>>> meaning specified as a finite expression of language
>>>>> is rejected.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So?
>>>>
>>>> Tarski's x like Godel's G are know to be true by an infinite 
>>>> sequence of truth preserving operations.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Every time that you affirm your above error you prove
>>> yourself to be a liar.
>>
>> What error?
>>
>> We know, that in the system the statements are made, tehre is an 
>> infinite chain of truth preserving operationf from teh fundamental 
>> truths of the sytsems to the conclusion.
>>
>> We know that because in a meta-theory we can develop additional 
>> knowledge allowing us to see the infinite chain, with something like 
>> an induction property or something else that reduces the infinite to 
>> finite.
>>
>>>
>>> On 7/8/2024 9:59 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>  > No, infinite "proofs" determine TRUTH, not knowledge.
>>>
>>> You could just say, "I didn't say that correctly"
>>> and we would be done.
>>
>> Right, an infinite "proof", in quotes because that is the term YOU 
>> use, even though there is no such thing, but in actuality it is an 
>> infinite chain of truth preserving operations  DO establish that 
>> something is True in the system, but by being infinite, we can never 
>> dirrectly follow that path to know it.
> 
> That was your mistake. You said that we could know it.

Because we can, by knowledge gained in the meta-system.

Knowledge can cross system boundries when the system are properly 
related to allow it.

> 
> Do I have to repeat the word "know" in you quote below
> 100 times before you can see it?

No, because you don't seem to understand that we can KNOW something 
about a system due to knowledge from a properly related system.

If you deny that, then your whole idea of a unversal knowldege system 
breaks, as you can't get anything into it.

> 
>  >>> Tarski's x like Godel's G are know to be true
>  >>> by an infinite sequence of truth preserving operations.
> 
>