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From: Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: The insane progress nobody is talking about
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2024 09:39:55 -0700
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On Wed, 26 Jun 2024 18:23:16 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
<dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:

>On 6/26/2024 8:50 AM, Paul S Person wrote:
>> On Tue, 25 Jun 2024 15:42:48 -0400, Cryptoengineer
>> <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote:
>>=20
>>> On 6/23/2024 9:12 PM, Joy Beeson wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 20 Jun 2024 11:07:21 -0600, John Savard
>>>> <quadibloc@servername.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, 20 Jun 2024 09:15:56 -0700, Paul S Person
>>>>> <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Kind of like Rapid Transit, which promises that, in 30 years, =
there
>>>>>> will be 30% fewer cars on the road /than there would be without =
it/,
>>>>>> not 30% fewer than there are today.
>>>>>
>>>>> Here in Edmonton, a couple of years ago we had a massive change to =
all
>>>>> our bus routes.
>>>>>
>>>>> The main upshot for the inner city is that the routes have been
>>>>> "optimized", but their frequency of service has been reduced in =
many
>>>>> instances, meaning a bus trip needs to be planned ahead, not done =
on
>>>>> impulse. (This makes it easier to comply with the single-use bag
>>>>> bylaw!)
>>>>>
>>>>> This was done to free up resources to increase bus service to the
>>>>> suburbs. The hope was that this would result in the people whoi =
live
>>>>> there, who pretty much all have cars, taking the bus more often.
>>>>>
>>>>> It is a good intention, since reducing carbon emissions is =
important,
>>>>> but expecting people with cars to start taking the bus? Anyone who
>>>>> lived in the real world would have known this was ludicrous. So =
they
>>>>> just ruined the bus service for people who need the bus for no =
reason.
>>>>
>>>> I will start using the bus service when it takes me from where I am =
to
>>>> where I want to go, and picks me up when I have my coat on, no =
sooner
>>>> and not much later.
>>>>
>>>> Doesn't matter, since this town has no bus service -- and can't have
>>>> any.  Mass transit works only when masses want to transit.
>>>
>>> For someone who already has a car to switch to public transit would
>>> require the PT to be *substantially* cheaper, faster, or more
>>> convenient.
>>>
>>> It can happen, but, for example, a commute to my last workplace by
>>> PT would take over 4.5 hours, vs 45 minutes to an hour by car. It
>>> would include about 20 minutes of walking, commuter rail, Boston T,
>>> and a bus.
>>>
>>> It would be hard to persuade me to do that.
>>=20
>> And so it should be.
>>=20
>> I haven't driven since 1983. I haven't owned a car since 1982, and
>> that was in West Germany. I really like public transit.
>>=20
>> But someone with the commute you describe cannot be expected to use
>> it. And other situations exist, such as weekly grocery shopping for a
>> large family, or having to transport entire 12-year-old soccer teams
>> around.
>
>And that's kind of the problem.  Our whole society is built around=20
>families having, AND USING, cars.

In the 'burbs, sure.

And people with cars are adept at finding places that only a car can
get to. I one met a young woman who lived across Lake Washington
(maybe Kirkland or Bellevue), attended the UW campus in NE Seattle,
and worked in (IIRC) Ballard (could have been West Seattle). Her
commutes were 100% dependent on having her car in working order at all
times.

Then again, as others have documented here, it is entirely possible to
select a home and a job that work with public transit only to have the
public transit disappear and leave only an automobile as an option for
commuting. This is a problem for everyone, really.
--=20
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"