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From: Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: 8 & 9 year old girls riding bicycles
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2024 11:55:22 -0500
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On Thu, 26 Dec 2024 11:21:18 -0500, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@gXXmail.com> wrote:

>On 12/25/2024 8:12 PM, John B. wrote:
>> On Wed, 25 Dec 2024 19:13:18 -0500, Frank Krygowski
>> <frkrygow@gXXmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> On 12/25/2024 3:25 PM, AMuzi wrote:
>>>> On 12/25/2024 1:26 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>>> On 12/25/2024 4:53 AM, John B. wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've mentioned numerous times that my family had guns in the house for
>>>>>> 3 generations with no one being shoot. But reality apparently has no
>>>>>> bearing on what some people want to be true.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think there's no way to logically converse with people who think one
>>>>> or two anecdotes are more valid than reams of carefully gathered data.
>>>>>
>>>>> So much for science!
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> For actual numbers:
>>>>
>>>> 400 million civilian firearms with just under 20,000 firearm homicides
>>>> per year, one per 20,000 firearms.
>>>>
>>>> https://usafacts.org/data-projects/firearms-suicides
>>>>
>>>> About 100 million bicycles
>>>>
>>>> https://electronwheel.com/bike-facts-and-statistics/
>>>>
>>>> for about 1300 deaths, one per 73,528 bicycles
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> https://injuryfacts.nsc.org/home-and-community/safety-topics/bicycle-
>>>> deaths/
>>>>
>>>> Which is a lower rate, only 27% of the likelihood of death per bicycle
>>>> as per firearm.
>>>>
>>>> 283,400,986 autos and light trucks in USA
>>>>
>>>> https://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/how-many-cars-are-in-the-us.html
>>>>
>>>> with 44,534 auto/ light truck deaths, one per 6363 vehicles.
>>>>
>>>> https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/accidental-injury.htm
>>>>
>>>> That's over 3x (3.14) more dangerous per vehicle as per firearm.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> For an anecdote, all four of my firearms have been oiled and cased,
>>>> undisturbed in any way, for well over a month. Not one of them has
>>>> jumped up and wrought mayhem. Not even a little bit.
>>>
>>> Nice try, Andrew, but that's a thorough and elaborate attempt at
>>> distraction.
>>>
>>> The issue specifically being discussed is whether there's more risk of
>>> being shot - or killed by gunshot - when there is a gun in the house,
>>> versus no gun in the house.
>>>
>>> The data is clear, and not even close. Even accounting for differences
>>> in neighborhood climate (or comparing houses that are both in the same
>>> sorts of neighborhoods) if you have a gun in the house, it's more likely
>>> that people will be harmed or killed by that gun.
>>>
>>> Of course there are houses with guns that have not had that experience.
>>> Just as there are people who smoked and did not die of lung cancer.
>>> Nobody is claiming 100% of guns cause death, nor that 100% of gun owner
>>> households have gun deaths. The evidence is that the risk is over twice
>>> as high in those households, not 100%.
>>>
>>> Citing bicycle crashes, car crashes, or any other source of harm are
>>> attempts at distraction.
>> 
>> 
>> Ah yes but ignoring reality is equally as fault.Example, according to
>> FBI data Blacks (forgive the description as I'm not up to date on the
>> current politically correct term) who comprise something like 13% of
>> the U.S. population commit more then 50% of homicides in the U.S.
>> Do you suppose that a study made in a site with a large percent of
>> Black residents might, just possible, be a tiny bit different then a
>> site with fewer, or even no, Blacks?
>
>Again (and again!) at least one of the papers I cited compared 
>households that were as similar as possible, _except_ for guns.
>
>And anyway, what do you think we should do about blacks? Pretend they're 
>a different species, so they don't count?

A few people who had guns in their homes got shot. Many, many people
who have had guns in their homes did not get shot.

--
C'est bon
Soloman