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From: Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: China clamps down on those damned bicyclists
Date: 22 Nov 2024 10:16:13 GMT
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Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
> On 21 Nov 2024 23:14:30 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
> 
>> Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
>>> On 21 Nov 2024 14:49:32 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>>>>> On 11/21/2024 4:53 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
>>>>>> Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Wed, 20 Nov 2024 20:22:21 -0300, Shadow <Sh@dow.br> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Wed, 20 Nov 2024 11:47:52 -0600, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On 11/20/2024 11:22 AM, Shadow wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 20 Nov 2024 09:27:31 -0600, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.chinadaily.com.cn/a/202411/11/WS67315c6fa310f1265a1cc95c.html
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> "For university students, grabbing a shared bike ...."
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> What's a "shared bike" ? Not a tandem, judging from the pics.
>>>>>>>>>> There is only one person on each bike.
>>>>>>>>>> []'s
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Rental fleets like this:
>>>>>>>>> https://divvybikes.com/how-it-works
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Which is a modern system. In 1967, Amsterdm had a 'white
>>>>>>>>> bike' share system for basic commuter bicycles. Painted
>>>>>>>>> white with directions printed, anyone could ride one, park
>>>>>>>>> it in a public area and leave it for the next person to use.
>>>>>>>>> That actually worked for Nederlanders for a time.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2022-02-26/the-dutch-anarchists-who-launched-a-bikesharing-revolution
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> (photos!)
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I had no idea anything like that existed. What an amazing
>>>>>>>> project.
>>>>>>>> Here in Brazil gangs of armed robbers "hijack" riders.
>>>>>>>> Sometimes the rider is armed, so they take his bike AND his gun...
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> A similar system was tried here and there, notably in my
>>>>>>>>> city in 1971 (I worked on that and built/painted many bikes
>>>>>>>>> from used/scrap).  They were mostly pulled from the lake a
>>>>>>>>> year later, with the rest completely disappeared. Different
>>>>>>>>> culture I suppose.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> If people are taught that socialism is a "bad" thing, I would
>>>>>>>> not expect anything else. They will never understand the concept of
>>>>>>>> "ours". They only understand "mine".
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Most people don't need to be taught that socialism is a "bad" thing.
>>>>>>> All they have to do is understand what it is.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> C'est bon
>>>>>>> Soloman
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Judging by the (American) comments on here I?d say they largely don?t and
>>>>>> confuse it with communism etc.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Roger Merriman
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Marx, who ought to know, used the two terms interchangeably 
>>>>> except in an instance where he wrote that socialism is a 
>>>>> necessary intermediate step to communism.
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> I?m sure he did! And deliberately so but doesn?t make it true!
>>>> 
>>>> Roger Merriman
>>> 
>>> Socialism is simply "Communism light." Social Democracy and Democratic
>>> Socialism are contradictions in terms. Many, perhaps most children
>>> resent and resists adult intrusion into their lives. Why any adult
>>> would submit to that is a mystery.
>>> 
>>> --
>>> C'est bon
>>> Soloman
>>> 
>> 
>> No socialism really isn’t just Communism lite, Communism is quite a
>> different beast, where as Socialism certainly as practiced by governments
>> is generally just a means of tempering rampant capitalism ie trying to keep
>> to the sweet spot.
>> 
>> Roger Merriman
> 
> The "official" classic definition of Sociaism is public (that means
> the government) ownership of the means of production. That means the
> government runs all the businesses, decides what gets produced and
> detirmines and pays everyone's wages.
> 
No thats communism socialism does often mean state owned services so
utilities and health services but allows plenty of space for private
businesses.

> Now I know the current version of "socialism" is that the government
> merely makes the laws and rules for all the above, without actually
> owning the businesses.

Lots the countries own utilities or part of them, USA for example has
public funded passenger rail. 
> 
> There was a considerable revolt against that in the USA a few weeks
> ago. 
> 
Don’t believe it was a landslide election nor voted on in that regard, very
few of even your “hard left” politicians would be socialist, as USA is so
to the right.
> --
> C'est bon
> Soloman
> 

Roger Merriman