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From: John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: House arrest after killing cyclist in hit and run.
Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2025 20:21:12 +0700
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On 1 Mar 2025 12:40:18 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:

>Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>> On 2/28/2025 8:09 PM, AMuzi wrote:
>>> On 2/28/2025 5:40 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>>> On 2/28/2025 3:18 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> In my view, a person who kills someone with their car should never, 
>>>>>> ever be allowed to drive again.
>>>>>> 
>>>> First, let's acknowledge that rule will never be implemented in the 
>>>> U.S. But if it were, driver caution would increase many times over.
>>>> 
>>>> After the first few "dumbshit walks in front of car" episodes actually 
>>>> resulted in "no more driving" and were publicized, motorists might 
>>>> begin slowing to non-fatal speeds when pedestrians (or bicyclists) are 
>>>> within walk-in- front range.
>>>> 
>>>> As I've said here before, if an overhead crane operator killed someone 
>>>> in a factory, I think they'd never be allowed to operate the crane 
>>>> again, no matter what their excuse.
>>>> 
>>>> Humans have given up far more than we should have to motordom. Streets 
>>>> and roads were once the domain of pedestrians, of kids playing, of 
>>>> people interacting. Turning them entirely over to motorists was a 
>>>> deliberate campaign goal of the car manufacturers.
>>>> 
>>>> https://marker.medium.com/the-invention-of-jaywalking- afd48f994c05
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> I (naively?) assumed you meant 'by negligence or malice' and I was happy 
>>> to agree with that.
>>> 
>>> But I can't agree with you here.  Extend that argument and we'll charge 
>>> train operators with murder when jerkoffs drive around the gate.  Or 
>>> auto drivers who hit red light running cyclists for that matter.
>> 
>> Given the legal system of the United States, I'd assume that if such a 
>> law were implemented, there would be gaggles of lawyers rushing to any 
>> accused motorist to defend his right to run down anyone who impeded his 
>> speed.
>> 
>> So think of my position as an initial step in negotiations. Let it apply 
>> in, say, residential areas, where kids should be able to play in 
>> streets. Or in pedestrian heavy business districts.
>> 
>> But as we all know, the present situation is closest to "I didn't see 
>> him!" or "He came out of nowhere!" followed by at most a slap on the 
>> wrist. And any imperfection in the pedestrian's behavior is a coupon for 
>> no motorist penalty at all.
>> 
>> Locally, about six months ago we had a young, well loved, well respected 
>> music teacher, church organist killed by a car when walking across a 
>> street. About a week ago, another young man was killed crossing the 
>> plaza-infested five lane at 6 AM. Details on the first are sketchy to me 
>> - it sounds like he was in a legal crosswalk - but cops said the latter 
>> was "not crossing in a designated crosswalk" so the motorist is off 
>> completely free. And in a different city, a young woman I know well was 
>> knocked to the ground and injured while crossing in a crosswalk with a 
>> green "walk" signal.
>> 
>> (BTW, Ohio law has a virtual crosswalk at any intersection, whether it's 
>> marked or not. Still, expecting pedestrians to walk an extra half mile 
>> to avoid being called a "jaywalker" seems unfair to me.)
>> 
>> I'd like a law that makes motorists think "Holy shit, there's a 
>> pedestrian. I'd better be _really_ careful."
>> 
>
>Presumed liability with the hierarchy of users, ie the idea that larger
>vehicles bring the risk associated with travel, which seems fair enough,
>and thus they have to prove it wasn’t their fault.
>
>Seems to work, though I’ve not looked at it with details..
>
>Roger Merriman

Here, and I suspect in most countries, heavy trucks are the "safest"
thing on the highway. Or at least they have the least "accidents". By
the same token small motorcycles - 100 - 125 cc have the most.

-- 
Cheers,

John B.