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From: vallor <vallor@cultnix.org>
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates
Date: 23 Apr 2025 07:21:55 GMT
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On Wed, 23 Apr 2025 05:22:39 -0000 (UTC), RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com>
wrote in <slrn100gu8s.3s3p.ronb02NOSPAM@3020m.home>:

> On 2025-04-23, pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> wrote:
>> On 2025-04-21, RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On 2025-04-19, CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
>>>> On 4/18/25 16:46, RonB wrote:
>>>>> On 2025-04-18, Borax Man <rotflol2@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2025-04-17, CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2025-04-17 10:04, Borax Man wrote:
>>>>>>>> ["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.advocacy.]
>>>>>>>> On 2025-04-17, CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 2025-04-16 23:06, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 16 Apr 2025 08:55:12 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> At what point do we finally give up?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> When the people start to see through those vendors’ multi-million-dollar
>>>>>>>>>> marketing campaigns telling everybody how wonderful they are.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> In other words, never.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I would blame the ignorance of the common user much more than any
>>>>>>>>> marketing campaign. You'd be surprised at how oblivious most people are
>>>>>>>>> to the operating system they're using. Heck, this complete disregard of
>>>>>>>>> the operating system is part of what made it easy for me to "sell" the
>>>>>>>>> idea of using Linux to people who owned HP laptops which had tremendous
>>>>>>>>> problems with Windows or to teachers who simply want to be able to use
>>>>>>>>> their computers rather than constantly be locked out of them. As long as
>>>>>>>>> the operating system manages to get the job done, they don't care if
>>>>>>>>> it's Linux or Windows. My dad is one such person. He actually much
>>>>>>>>> preferred Mint to Windows when I installed it on a cheap laptop I got
>>>>>>>>> him, but he's fine with Windows on the Intel NUC he eventually replaced
>>>>>>>>> that machine with. Until it bugs out, there is no reason to switch over.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Can confirm, at least in some cases.  My wife needed a new laptop, but
>>>>>>>> she wanted Apple.  They're expensive, far more so when all you do is use
>>>>>>>> a web-browser.  So I said I'll take care of the laptop, I'll find one
>>>>>>>> that is second hand, and will be supported for a long long time.  (One
>>>>>>>> of the bugbears she had about Apple was how the OS and software become
>>>>>>>> obsolete and could not be upgraded).  I put Linux, and there was a tiny
>>>>>>>> bit of teething because it was different, but she's been using it for
>>>>>>>> years successfully.  She's has no idea about Linux, doesn't know she's
>>>>>>>> running Fedora.  Shes used my desktop machine, so had a little
>>>>>>>> familiarity with it.  But surprisingly, theres be no issues, and few
>>>>>>>> questions, aside from "how do I copy files from the USB stick" and some
>>>>>>>> desktop config.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That's part of why I didn't mind that my very low bid for this Apple
>>>>>>> laptop was successful, and that I needed to pursue the purchase. To an
>>>>>>> Apple user, this MacBook Air 2017 is obsolete and meant for little more
>>>>>>> than recycling. For me, it does everything I would need a laptop to do
>>>>>>> at work. With Linux, it stays out of the landfill and can continue to be
>>>>>>> used for another decade. Heck, I might use it until I retire. Unlike
>>>>>>> most other teachers, I am _aware_ that it uses Linux, but I am also
>>>>>>> aware that our work does not require this kind of hardware to be
>>>>>>> upgraded as often as our boards and manufacturers require us to.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think that people who know next to nothing, will find a switch to
>>>>>>>> Linux easier, because they have so few ingraned workflows and
>>>>>>>> expectations, and use the system at such a shallow level, that you could
>>>>>>>> switch and they'll barely notice, as long as the desktop is roughly
>>>>>>>> similar.  It is more the intermediate users, who would be disrupted the
>>>>>>>> most.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The desktops being roughly similar is only a necessity for users who
>>>>>>> were already old when they learned MacOS or Windows and did so
>>>>>>> stubbornly. Considering how difficult it was for them to adopt that
>>>>>>> much, you wouldn't want to put an entirely different operating system in
>>>>>>> front of them. For anyone else, a switch from Windows to Gnome or
>>>>>>> Cinnamon shouldn't be such a chore.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I switched a friend to Linux, as he wanted to escape Microsoft AI and
>>>>>> surveillance and the like.  He wanted a distro most similar to Windows
>>>>>> for the desktop, but as I had already installed Linux Mint on the
>>>>>> laptop, using Cinnamon, I decided he's better off having his desktop
>>>>>> computer configured to be the same as the laptop.  No issues so far.
>>>>>> Cinnamon is quite Windows-like.  Gnome on the other hand, I think that
>>>>>> is more of a leap.  I myself didn't really find it all that usable or
>>>>>> appealing.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I think if you're coming over from a Mac Ubuntu might be more appealing. I
>>>>> say this just because it seems to look more like a Mac, not because of what
>>>>> little Mac experience I have.
>>>>
>>>> I would say that Ubuntu's default interface is actually superior to what 
>>>> MacOS offers. It might not have hardware that integrates intelligently 
>>>> with the desktop, but it has a number of things Mac users can only 
>>>> manage to do if they install additional software. Snapping to the sides, 
>>>> for example. Ubuntu 25.04 also has hardware support that is superior to 
>>>> MacOS since it runs on practically every imaginable configuration under 
>>>> the sun, can detect just about any printer and scanner without requiring 
>>>> additional drivers, and even manages to have excellent gamepad support. 
>>>> For example, I have a Thrustmaster eSwap X Pro that needs additional 
>>>> software even in Windows. In 24.10, it didn't detect, but in 25.04 it 
>>>> works out of the box. I would say that this release actually works 
>>>> better on my hardware by default than even Windows does.
>>>
>>> I'm not really a fan of either Ubuntu's desktop or Mac's desktop, so I'll 
>>> not argue on this point. I know I don't like Window snapping, but there are 
>>> a few things in the Mac's desktop I don't like at all (I've mentioned them 
>>> in the past). So I'm quite willing to believe Ubuntu's desktop is better 
>>> than Mac's, but still not something I like or want to use.
>>>
>>
>> I'm not a fan of Ubuntu but I do respect what Apple has done with the Mac.
>> Both my son and daughter are Macheads and for me seeing how all Apple
>> devices integrate into the Mac is quite impressive.
>>
>> I'm reasonably certain this can be done with Linux/Windows although
>> I have never tried but the point is with Apple it just picks up the devices
>> and works.
>>
>> Of course that convienience factor is going to cost you plenty.
>> Not worth it for me.
> 
> Device integration is something I avoid like the plague, so Apple has allure 
> for me at all.

(Chromebooks and Android.)

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