Path: ...!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail
From: Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.lang.python
Subject: Re: Couldn't install numpy on Python 2.7
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2024 03:59:40 +1000
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <mailman.116.1718215194.2909.python-list@python.org>
References: <CAGJtH9QConSeiZfChKaJxz4wKovKj4XUASm5ckEf=zUuD=Pypw@mail.gmail.com>
 <mailman.111.1718191856.2909.python-list@python.org>
 <L7iaO.9557$IG21.6265@fx15.ams4>
 <004401dabce6$004569e0$00d03da0$@gmail.com>
 <399785e3-0cab-4e38-b219-89863a762d38@mrabarnett.plus.com>
 <004f01dabcef$95d76d60$c1864820$@gmail.com>
 <CAPTjJmo5sEbFWje5JHAREpVOsJHQ-u4ZtHzQAubS2ox41zDt4Q@mail.gmail.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de vEJXx1kiIiJDpzZ5uDikzgmdfYtYQKeq00msrSwYCCLQ==
Cancel-Lock: sha1:G5sbmjIGJ/OsVRoahoJfxYHAOPw= sha256:qVBiXgyfrGVENE7oSpb48wXjbUFt4AZk+d7cJjy6JxA=
Return-Path: <rosuav@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: python-list@python.org
Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org
Authentication-Results: mail.python.org; dkim=pass
 reason="2048-bit key; unprotected key"
 header.d=gmail.com header.i=@gmail.com header.b=Oe79jhYn;
 dkim-adsp=pass; dkim-atps=neutral
X-Spam-Status: OK 0.001
X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 1.00; '*S*': 0.00; 'python?': 0.03;
 'argument': 0.04; 'fairly': 0.05; 'planned': 0.05;
 'subject:install': 0.07; '11.': 0.09; '2.7': 0.09; 'binaries':
 0.09; 'fact,': 0.09; 'linux': 0.09; 'numpy': 0.09; 'upgrading':
 0.09; 'subject:Python': 0.12; '2.7.': 0.16; '2024': 0.16; 'avi':
 0.16; 'chrisa': 0.16; 'computers.': 0.16; 'decision?': 0.16;
 'easy,': 0.16; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris
 angelico': 0.16; 'gross': 0.16; 'interpreter': 0.16; 'nonsense':
 0.16; 'received:mail-lj1-x22a.google.com': 0.16; 'sounds': 0.16;
 'subject:2.7': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.16; 'problem': 0.16; 'python':
 0.16; 'code.': 0.17; "can't": 0.17; 'hardware': 0.19; 'thu,':
 0.19; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.20; 'examples': 0.25; 'jun': 0.26;
 "isn't": 0.27; 'packages': 0.31; "doesn't": 0.32; 'context': 0.32;
 'fine.': 0.32; 'python-list': 0.32; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com':
 0.32; 'but': 0.32; 'there': 0.33; 'windows': 0.34; 'release':
 0.34; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.34; 'received:google.com': 0.34;
 'computer.': 0.35; 'one.': 0.35; 'runs': 0.35; 'yes,': 0.35;
 'from:addr:gmail.com': 0.35; 'fix': 0.36; 'people': 0.36;
 'source': 0.36; 'change': 0.36; 'hard': 0.37; 'necessary': 0.39;
 'want': 0.40; 'popular': 0.60; 'here.': 0.61; "there's": 0.61;
 'here': 0.62; 'feel': 0.63; 'skip:k 10': 0.64; 'requirement':
 0.64; 'your': 0.64; 'decided': 0.67; 'decision': 0.68; 'right':
 0.68; 'older': 0.70; 'future': 0.72; 'demand': 0.75; 'discovered':
 0.80; 'bothered': 0.84; 'dead,': 0.84; 'realise': 0.84; 'unpaid':
 0.84
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1718215192; x=1718819992; darn=python.org;
 h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version
 :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=kc1PniWvWKfNEZ47jhwnkN3zVUfdNuPrRr/wW+dneg4=;
 b=Oe79jhYnQZdzp8Hb5jq7kHxNeedNL7pui9dVwvOYn8L0I7ds7BOnfx8QfRWtovaVU3
 yzASFeynhUE+y6l2PZ86O0uc2hs3ctmp9C6WIwOGBeWbne7dIt+Xg4cSoFtAXacEc1QP
 qQ66EzSWsTxjzdHphXk4LS4AGUSey1BxpP/tcUC4lUkXSNNUKCB9hZr7EJePu5BT3BaG
 9fE9YuSlgIhACJLXmJXVSNbKnKvYDqjXUedkgz/Mx8butKXWT4WvU1YNJ1ZbmN0UIuGm
 wpneNozPFWcK1VgJV0qaM26euCcpt3dd3NF9YOGpFCJtXugVh6ZGw+ZUyt9WKNNklekS
 rFVA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1718215192; x=1718819992;
 h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version
 :x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=kc1PniWvWKfNEZ47jhwnkN3zVUfdNuPrRr/wW+dneg4=;
 b=L/55hXiSfi08QPHHCHWx5g2rr1jzLXSNeutCNdSsU+1ko/KXxPQCHOXTQjxxoRxHJT
 6z0HlBAf83Rg56+8fev+g283ce06FXOYvkK8vAE+ThiHFs5taoLI24CIP8QKueCOY7Zl
 5nsC47HiKrE4KGnNzoWnlXTX9K3tkBNXuGJO7vSSAevBKr36AtGioPnA8ok9INVWGlsJ
 kL9YwijdYNG71XS4wv/2CBatA9btlb9924QE76fittztHk3B2N1zZ6H7G/+vRLkn9WYi
 Y1aEcVVqOe7HP/BfHwSc49UN+5qDHTqylvvr4bJpHcSzyOfSy3L/XepF6e7PxU6NoUVl
 yrWw==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YxoKawy7l8dWHGy0BPFyVcM6lMtpCaO4I3m0XWvIEOZe2wLW/UR
 JbBz1L6kXpOGnc6iZI9d6CA4bC5iaAErbvKo1ZyuyaaYwfUSUZZZgrGI/SG/owp32jveEPAAeHA
 mGUxy2CEJhKbTvM3QZz17Oy4JIhWY1Q==
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IE4mQoK1a+UHV8X9U8nTjLt2GHiKE8w31ysLTOR/E0QuTwyXJS57OeFbcm2hmD82/TOqb/HpOIvrG60TrvCqBI=
X-Received: by 2002:a2e:3814:0:b0:2eb:e505:ebbf with SMTP id
 38308e7fff4ca-2ebfc99878dmr14820921fa.39.1718215192026; Wed, 12 Jun 2024
 10:59:52 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <004f01dabcef$95d76d60$c1864820$@gmail.com>
X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language
 <python-list.python.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-list>,
 <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/>
List-Post: <mailto:python-list@python.org>
List-Help: <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>,
 <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=subscribe>
X-Mailman-Original-Message-ID: <CAPTjJmo5sEbFWje5JHAREpVOsJHQ-u4ZtHzQAubS2ox41zDt4Q@mail.gmail.com>
X-Mailman-Original-References: <CAGJtH9QConSeiZfChKaJxz4wKovKj4XUASm5ckEf=zUuD=Pypw@mail.gmail.com>
 <mailman.111.1718191856.2909.python-list@python.org>
 <L7iaO.9557$IG21.6265@fx15.ams4>
 <004401dabce6$004569e0$00d03da0$@gmail.com>
 <399785e3-0cab-4e38-b219-89863a762d38@mrabarnett.plus.com>
 <004f01dabcef$95d76d60$c1864820$@gmail.com>
Bytes: 7529

On Thu, 13 Jun 2024 at 03:41, AVI GROSS via Python-list
<python-list@python.org> wrote:
>
> Change is hard even when it may be necessary.
>
> The argument often is about whether some things are necessary or not.
>
> Python made a decision but clearly not a unanimous one.

What decision? To not release any new versions of Python 2? That isn't
actually the OP's problem here - the Python interpreter runs just
fine. But there's no numpy build for the OP's hardware and Python 2.7.

So if you want to complain about Python 2.7 being dead, all you have
to do is go through all of the popular packages and build binaries for
all modern computers. If that sounds easy, go ahead and do it; if it
sounds hard, realise that open source is not a democracy, and you
can't demand that other people do more and more and more unpaid work
just because you can't be bothered upgrading your code.

> My current PC was not upgradable because of the new hardware requirement
> Microsoft decided was needed for Windows 11.

Yes, and that's a good reason to switch to Linux for the older computer.

> I mention this in the context of examples of why even people who are fairly
> knowledgeable do not feel much need to fix what does not feel broken.

It doesn't feel broken, right up until it does. The OP has discovered
that it *IS* broken. Whining that it doesn't "feel broken" is nonsense
when it is, in fact, not working.

> When is Python 4 coming?

Is this just another content-free whine, or are you actually curious
about the planned future of Python? If the latter, there is **PLENTY**
of information out there and I don't need to repeat it here.

Please don't FUD.

ChrisA