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From: dn <PythonList@DancesWithMice.info>
Newsgroups: comp.lang.python
Subject: Re: Help needed - - running into issues with python and its tools
Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2024 12:08:54 +1200
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On 4/08/24 09:34, o1bigtenor via Python-list wrote:
> On Sat, Aug 3, 2024 at 4:06 PM dn via Python-list <python-list@python.org>
> wrote:
> 
>> On 4/08/24 08:17, o1bigtenor via Python-list wrote:
>>> Greetings
>>>
>>> Looking at ESP8266 and wanting to program it using micropython (really
>>> don't want to have to learn C++ (not enough hours in the day as it
>> is!!)).
>>>
>>> One of the tools I need to be able to use is esptools - -  well in the
>>> devuan world you need to run that on either Devaun 3 or 5 - - - its just
>>> not available on devuan 4.
>>>
>>> Tried installing all the tools I need using downloads and .deb installs
>> but
>>> then I need to have python3.12 and that's also not part of Devuan4.
>>>
>>> Not versed enough to set up a good venv (if that's possible) so that I
>>> could work in that specific venv and have my cake (and get to eat it too
>>> (grin!).
>>>
>>> Suggestions - - - ideas - - - please?
>>
>> Sorry if this offends, but this is a list of short-cuts and reasons why
>> they don't work (immediately).
>>
>>
>> Have just come from a discussion about 'how to start a project'. Amongst
>> the questions to ask are: "what resources do we have (or can add) to
>> achieve?".
>>
> 
> Fair question details interleaved - - -
> 
>>
>> In this case, if Python-skill is a "personnel-resource" (and C++ a
>> "constraint"), will question the ESP over Raspberry Pi (say)?
>>
> 
> Well - - - RPi world technical specs is usable from -20 to 60 C (iirc on
> the top number)
> and for my project I absolutely need to have usability to at least -40 - -
> could possibly do a bit less but -35 C is a hard requirement so the RPi
> and Pico (which I would like to use) is out but ESP8266 runs in that -40 to
> 65 C
> range.

Interesting, but creates a mis-match of tools - battles for you to fight...


>> Why talking of Python 3.12 when the solution involves MicroPython?
>>
> 
> Because one uses psytool on one computer to transfer a program to the
> MicroPython system.  In fact there are a set of tools that need Python3.12
> to be able to do this and therefore the question.
> 
>>
>>
>> Perhaps need to take a step back and look at 'options' - relate needs to
>> resources, and evaluate the impact of each decision on later ones - as
>> well as against your personal skills (modify objectives to limits, or
>> accept that some learning/training will be necessary as pre-requisite to
>> (being able to) attack the project).
>>
>> I have been investigating using a venv but am not finding clear directions
> so
> that I could set up Python3.12 inside (along with the other needed tools).
> The
> more I'm looking the less useful most of the information I'm finding is
> becoming.
> Therefore I thought I would go to the python gurus for information - - -
> which I
> have.
> 
> So please - - - how do I set up a venv so that I can install and run python
> 3.12
> (and other needed programs related to 3.12) inside?

If you mean venv itself, which "directions" have you reviewed?
This one (https://python.land/virtual-environments/virtualenv) seems 
very straight-forward and shows "What's inside a venv?" to include 
python.exe. Given that venv is more-or-less the official/traditional 
solution, what are you doing differently - perhaps the question is 
lacking detail.
(see also @Cameron's take)

Personally, I'm using Poetry (https://python-poetry.org) which seemed 
just as easy to pick-up; plus pyenv to maintain multiple versions of 
Python on one machine.

-- 
Regards,
=dn