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From: Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Fine Tuning Shifting
Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2024 14:26:33 -0800
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On Thu, 14 Nov 2024 07:23:11 -0500, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>On 11/13/2024 7:50 PM, cyclintom wrote:
>> Only an idiot like you doesn't know that fire departments well know how to put out gas fires with water.

>no, tommy, they don't. Only an idiot thinks they do.

Unfortunately, this time Tom is half right and half wrong.  See the
comments under "confusion":
<https://www.nfpa.org/education-and-research/home-fire-safety/lithium-ion-batteries/#faqs>

"Firefighters should use water to fight a lithium-ion battery fire.
Water works just fine as a fire extinguishing medium since the lithium
inside of these batteries are a lithium salt electrolyte and not pure
lithium metal. Confusion on this topic stems from the fact that pure
lithium (like what you see in the table of elements) is highly
reactive with water, while lithium salts are non-reactive with water.:
 
>> And the drooling idiot doesn't know that LITHIUM ION batteries cannot be put out with CO2 because they generate their own Oxygen.>  This is WHY fire departments tried to use WATER and not CO2 to lower the temperature below the ignition point.
>
>Where did I ever write that Li battery fires are put out with CO2?

Tom like to write what he wants other people to write so that Tom
looks intelligent.  However, he ALWAYS gets the quotation wrong,
especially when he adjusts his facts to make it look like Tom is right
and everyone else is wrong.  It's a cute trick for such discussions
because everyone end up arguing not with Tom, the source of the
erroneous "facts", but with the "facts", which according to Tom, can
only be attributable to someone else.  Tom tries to make it look like
he's restating what was said to be demonstrate that he understands
what was said, when he's actually adjusting what was said to match his
agenda.  Since Tom sees no value in honesty, pointing out Tom's
endless errors in attribution and citation, is a waste of time.

Anyway, CO2 displaces oxygen in the air.  Without oxygen, any fire
that depends on atmospheric oxygen to promote combustion, will be
extinguished.  CO2 is NOT considered an oxidizer but instead is a
"soft oxidizer".  CO2 can act as an oxidizer in the presence of a
catalyst and high temperatures.  However, there's nothing in a Li-Ion
battery that will serve as a catalyst.

In a gasoline fire, a CO2 fire extinguisher works that way.  However,
with fires that provide their own oxidizer, such as rocket fuel,
explosives and Li-Ion batteries, there's nothing to displace.  As long
as the hot fire continues to convert oxidizer into oxygen, the fire
will burn until it runs out of oxidizer.

Dumping water onto a Li-Ion fire has another benefit.  Evaporating the
water will cool down the fire.  Eventually, where won't be sufficient
heat to promote combustion and the fire will extinguish itself.

>ps, why do you insist on shouting LITHIUM ION?

Probably because Tom has finally realized that nobody is listening to
him because he has nothing worthwhile to say.


-- 
Jeff Liebermann                 jeffl@cruzio.com
PO Box 272      http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann      AE6KS    831-336-2558