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From: Cursitor Doom <cd@notformail.com>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design,us.politics
Subject: Re: kids these days
Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2024 16:40:18 +0100
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On Mon, 30 Sep 2024 14:35:52 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
wrote:

>On a sunny day (Mon, 30 Sep 2024 14:30:48 +0100) it happened Cursitor Doom
><cd@notformail.com> wrote in <3i9lfj57mhfe657c5mcbd3mmap61q4m1ik@4ax.com>:
>
>>On Mon, 30 Sep 2024 11:35:31 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On a sunny day (Mon, 30 Sep 2024 11:05:37 +0100) it happened Cursitor Doom
>>><cd@notformail.com> wrote in <2stkfjph6d7s5h50hafmsia5ep7209ds3e@4ax.com>:
>>>
>>>>On Mon, 30 Sep 2024 05:31:27 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On a sunny day (Sun, 29 Sep 2024 10:49:25 -0700) it happened john larkin
>>>>><JL@gct.com> wrote in <de4jfjlq704080370lfofh0k0bu3njqn9u@4ax.com>:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On Sun, 29 Sep 2024 17:04:57 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On a sunny day (Sun, 29 Sep 2024 17:41:36 +0100) it happened Cursitor Doom
>>>>>>><cd@notformail.com> wrote in <2h0jfjhlq7ic02h5f72a3ibsksv5mkg6aj@4ax.com>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>On Sun, 29 Sep 2024 13:22:31 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>>>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>On a sunny day (Sun, 29 Sep 2024 10:10:33 +0100) it happened Cursitor Doom
>>>>>>>>><cd@notformail.com> wrote in <d56ifj1angpnq16qhhb0vplmlr3tt7opnf@4ax.com>:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>On Fri, 27 Sep 2024 08:42:27 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>>>>>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>On a sunny day (Thu, 26 Sep 2024 16:21:31 -0700) it happened john larkin
>>>>>>>>>>><jl@glen--canyon.com> wrote in <v1rbfj18eqbgr1t9bfvdfqqmn1q91gcfof@4ax.com>:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>https://finance.yahoo.com/news/bosses-firing-gen-z-grads-111719818.html
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>Oh. I just hired one.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>There is a lot of truth in that article.
>>>>>>>>>>>I have had to work with newcomers, some knew nothing 
>>>>>>>>>>>But then when I started... in my first job designing a.o. mil stuff
>>>>>>>>>>>I had to figure it all out for myself the same day the requests got on the table.
>>>>>>>>>>>One old guy, who had some experience with electronics but had a lot with high power stuff..
>>>>>>>>>>>and a manager to rule us, was the environment, and a big factory floor building the things we came up with, and
>>>>>>>>>>>a test room (HV stuff 100 kV etc megawatt stuff.. and a little corner and oscilloscope for me to test what I came up
>>>>>>>>>>>with,
>>>>>>>>>>>build  proto circuits.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Later when starting in broadcasting we got 6 month in the school benches in their own studio, while getting payed,
>>>>>>>>>>>and exams after that, everything from audio, video, satellite, management, politics (who can do what, red phones sort
>>>>>>>>>>>of
>>>>>>>>>>>thing), the works.
>>>>>>>>>>>As that (video, audio etc) was my real interest, I found it relaxing and fun.
>>>>>>>>>>>Then when you are put in charge of a real event, I remember the first day I ran alone in a head control room
>>>>>>>>>>>I had to call my boss back from his dinner in some restaurant.. could not find the cables we had to swap
>>>>>>>>>>>to sync some remote location,
>>>>>>>>>>>turned out those were hidden under the floor boards ..
>>>>>>>>>>>Did not they tell you that?
>>>>>>>>>>> (Must have missed that :-) ).
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>It all depends,.
>>>>>>>>>>>Do you give the poor new guy training? ANY kind of training?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>He doesn't have to. John has this screening technique he uses for job
>>>>>>>>>>applicants. He shows them a diagram of two 1k resistors in series with
>>>>>>>>>>10V across them and asks them what the voltage where they join is. If
>>>>>>>>>>they freak out, burst into tears or defenestrate themselves, he knows
>>>>>>>>>>not to hire them. :-)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Yes I did read that posting
>>>>>>>>>Its hard, lemme see, e=m.c^12 likely does not help.
>>>>>>>>>to make it easier for me I use volts, so if 3k3 + 4k7 in series gives 8 volts
>>>>>>>>>then we know 3k3 gives 3.3 V across it and 4k7 4.7 volts across it
>>>>>>>>>Best is to use trimpots to get the right value, no math needed...
>>>>>>>>>And of course you need to bring the (multi?)meter impedance into play, especially for high
>>>>>>>>>value resistors and moving coil meters from old boat anchors for example.
>>>>>>>>>And there are LDRs and NTCs and PTCs, so we need to know all that
>>>>>>>>>and the temperature and light intensity...
>>>>>>>>>for the NTCs and PTCs we also need to know the current and time since switch on...
>>>>>>>>>So no wonder if they defenestrate themselves.
>>>>>>>>>An other issue maybe length contraction due to near light speed that may affect both measurement equipment and
>>>>>>>>>resistors.
>>>>>>>>>And reading those colored bands around some resistors to get the value.
>>>>>>>>>and wirewound, carbon composite, metal, 
>>>>>>>>> And then J.L. did not specify if it was DeeSee or AH!See
>>>>>>>>>Imagine 2 1k resistors, one wire-wound, the other metal flim,
>>>>>>>>>The wire-wound would work as inductor for RF, so would some small metal ones with some turns on it..
>>>>>>>>>And then there are tolerances, simple maybe for 2 resistors from the same batch
>>>>>>>>>but tolerances, sometimes a silver or gold band will give a clue
>>>>>>>>>will change the outcome.
>>>>>>>>>So as the saying goes: "Resistance is futile, you will be assimilated"
>>>>>>>>>Opps, composite carbon reisors maye aso be sensitve to moisture? And maybe pressue?
>>>>>>>>>Those would often go high in teefee sets...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Jan, you're massively over-complicating this! :-) The resistors in my
>>>>>>>>example are both 1k so it's half the supply rail. But you knew that
>>>>>>>>anyway.
>>>>>>>>The answers you gave show that you know your subject. Unfortunately,
>>>>>>>>as we know from what John's stated here before, the graduates he
>>>>>>>>interviews have no idea what the fuck they're doing. The Chinese are
>>>>>>>>going to kick our arses if they aren't already.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Oh - and carbon resistors are noisy. And I don't think you mentioned
>>>>>>>>the source resistance of the supply. We could go on. And on. And
>>>>>>>>on.... But that's not what John asked for. He only wanted a first
>>>>>>>>approximation which would be 5 Volts. But that's too much for today's
>>>>>>>>grads, it seems. :(
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Sure, but I find it hard to believe,
>>>>>>>we had a lab and were required to do measurements etc.. in my school days.
>>>>>>>Not only electronics, some mechanics too.
>>>>>>>But indeed there is nothing like practical experience, in my school
>>>>>>>it was known that only hobbyists would psss the exams...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Electronics is a huge field, on top of that now comes programming.. oh and now AI..
>>>>>>>And ever higher frequencies... ever more software (like peeseebee software for example)
>>>>>>>protocols, what not... standarss...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>And in spite of all that : US could do a moon return in the sixties, July 1969
>>>>>>>now they are stuck and need to be saved from the ISS..
>>>>>>>SpaceX just did sent up a rescue mission:
>>>>>>> https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cy89kz8ge41o
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>US IQ is dropping, no empire lasted forever..
>>>>>>
>>>>>>What's happening is that the normal distribution is getting wider, and
>>>>>>not just in the USA. Some of the fringes are geniuses, and a society
>>>>>>benefits from having even a few geniuses.
>>>>>
>>>>>Look at China
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Being reflexively anti-American is no substitute for thinking. I still
>>>>>>think that the USA is the best place to design electronics.
>>>>>
>>>>>I observe, like I do when I use a scope to see what is happening in a circuit.
>>>>>Now is-a-hell hits Jemen.. US weapon factories are having a party,
>>>>>you pay more taxes..
>>>>>Bad system.
>>>>>
>>>>>As your enemies get more powerful and more unite, you are a sitting duck.
>>>>>Just a big war industry making war to sell at taxpayer's cost
>>>>>making losses, a deficit the greatest on earth and in history.
>>>>>
>>>>>Should any sane person ADMIRE that disaster?
>>>>>Half senile president and an ego tripper criminal as aspiring precedent.
>>>>>
>>>>>Hide under the table I've heard is the tactics recommended by you leaders.
>>>>>?
>>>>
>>>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lg9scNl9h4Q
>>>
>>>Yep, that is the one :-)
>>
>>Indeed. But for those of us humans without shells, I'm assured hiding
>>under a school desk is equally effective for any nuclear blasts up to
>>10 megatons.
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>I couldn't find the version with advert at the end "sponsored by Acme
>>>>Cigarettes - the mild smoke for kids" :-)
>>>
>>>Oops.. 
>>>Anyways they are all on Fetanyl or something these days?
>>
>>Yeah, the under 10s are all on Fentanyl and the teenagers have moved
>>on to this stuff called 'duster' I gather. I'm told it's 20 times more
>>addictive than crack cocaine and Wallmart sells it for $2 a can. Kids
>>these days have it all. When I was young, street drugs didn't even
>>exist.
>
>Had to look up 'duster'
> https://www.therecoveryvillage.com/air-duster-abuse/air-duster-high/
>
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