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From: john larkin <jl@glen--canyon.com>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: energy in UK
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2025 14:02:31 -0700
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On Tue, 15 Apr 2025 09:49:06 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
<jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

>On 4/14/25 22:32, john larkin wrote:
>> On Mon, 14 Apr 2025 21:52:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
>> <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:
>> 
>>> On 4/14/25 16:40, john larkin wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 14 Apr 2025 11:58:43 +0100, Martin Brown
>>>> <'''newspam'''@nonad.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 13/04/2025 06:23, Bill Sloman wrote:
>>>>>> On 13/04/2025 4:16 am, john larkin wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.theregister.com/2025/04/10/uk_ai_energy_council_meets/
>>>>>
>>>>> They are on another planet. UK energy prices are sky high to the extent
>>>>> that making steel profitable here is completely impossible.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The UK still suffers from an old decision to base it's civil service on
>>>>>> a misunderstood version of the Chinese civil service.
>>>>>
>>>>> Unfortunately you are right about that.
>>>>>
>>>>> Each successive NESO Electricity Ten Year Statement (ETSY) report gets
>>>>> more and more fanciful about how Net Zero will be achieved. The
>>>>> important  technical content also disappears with each successive annual
>>>>> revision. Millibrain is being told it is all going very well.
>>>>>
>>>>> They have taken to hiding old ones so you can't compare actuality with
>>>>> prediction (unless you have taken the precaution of downloading them).
>>>>>
>>>>>> Chinese orthography is horrible and it took a lot of effort for anybody
>>>>>> to get literate and stay literate. Entry to the Chinese civil service
>>>>>> depended on proving that you could read and write, and any other
>>>>>> expertise was secondary.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The UK imagined that the candidates were being tested for pure
>>>>>> intellectual power. Being able to read and write English wasn't
>>>>>> difficult enough to test this, so they tested for competence in Latin
>>>>>> and Greek.
>>>>>
>>>>> They do have a few scientists and engineers in parliament but they are
>>>>> never given any significant roles. The joke at my university was why be
>>>>> a scientist (or engineer) when you can be a scientist's boss.
>>>>> Beancounters and lawyers rule the roost.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Science was despised - the civil service formula was scientist on tap,
>>>>>> not on top. When it comes to technical matters like generating and
>>>>>> distributing electric power cheaply, the English are still behind the
>>>>>> game, because the crucial choices are still made by some classically
>>>>>> educated mandarin who doesn't understand the problems in any detail.
>>>>>
>>>>> It is worse than that. They have fanciful schemes that will get us to
>>>>> net zero but only in their crazed imagination! The small problem of the
>>>>> laws of physics and in particular conservation of energy get in the way.
>>>>>
>>>>> The UK has an insane imbalance between production of power in the North
>>>>> and consumption of power in London and the South East. The main cables
>>>>> running N-S are routinely overloaded during daytime during winter.
>>>>>
>>>>> Page 6 of this mess shows the effects of the next decade of "improvements".
>>>>> Page 33 shows the pinch point at Thermal Boundary 7a
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.neso.energy/document/352001/download
>>>>>
>>>>> The pages that used to show locality and seasonal overloading of the
>>>>> network have been conveniently redacted form the 2024 edition.
>>>>
>>>> Radical improvements in fiberoptics, and cheap satellites, have hugely
>>>> reduced the cost to transport data. But AI has hugely increased the
>>>> energy requirement of computing.
>>>> [...]
>>>
>>> ... which again confirms my rule that any resource perceived to be
>>> cheap and abundant will be wasted until it becomes scarce and expensive.
>>>
>>> Jeroen Belleman
>> 
>> I can't think of an example of that rule.
>> 
>
>I just gave you one.
>
>Jeroen Belleman

Are you referring to energy poverty and de-industrialization in the
UK?

That will improve somewhat. People who are unemployed and cold and
hungry in the dark will vote in their interests.