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From: Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.repair
Subject: Re: Favourite Test Equipment
Date: Fri, 05 Apr 2024 07:49:30 GMT
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On a sunny day (Thu, 4 Apr 2024 11:56:23 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote in
<uum4h6$kmdl$1@dont-email.me>:

>Klaus Vestergaard Kragelund <klauskvik@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> On 01-04-2024 09:01, Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>> On a sunny day (Sun, 31 Mar 2024 18:41:18 +0100) it happened Cursitor Doom
>>> <cd@notformail.com> wrote in <9k7j0jlnbhs8qfg5m17pium0835meean83@4ax.com>:
>>> 
>>>> Hi all,
>>>> 
>>>> I'm starting to get a bit fed up with having my test equipment blow up
>>>> just when it's needed. This is the drawback with vintage gear; if it's
>>>> not used frequently then it can go *bang* the next time you switch it
>>>> on. It makes for good practice in repairing stuff, but wastes a lot of
>>>> time which could be better spent doing other things.
>>>> I think it's time I modernised my test gear. I was just wondering if
>>>> anyone has any recommendations they can share. Is there a particular
>>>> piece of test equipment you couldn't live without? Something you're
>>>> particularly impressed with? I'd be interested to know so I can
>>>> perhaps acquire said item and thereby reduce the number of explosions
>>>> I experience.
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> 
>>>> CD.
>>> 
>>> My 10 MHz Trio dual trace analog scope is from 1979 or there about, I
>>> blew up a channel once myself in the first week
>>> when I accidently touched a booster diode in a TV I was repairing with
>>> it, fixed it locating the problem with the other channel.
>>> Later I cracked the graticule when a soldering station fell on it from
>>> the table (scope stands on the ground)
>>> Made a new graticule.
>>> So, and still working perfectly, OK for all things I build with micros.
>>> For RF to about 1.6 GHz I use RTL_SDR USB sticks and the spectrum analyzer I wrote.
>>> and for AC DC measurements I have some made in China digital meters and an analog one.
>>> also a Voltcraft clamp-on meter for current when you do not - or cannot
>>> interrupt things with the meter impedance.
>>> Also have a Voltcraft soldering station.
>>> Blew up one of my digital meters a while back (volts on the resistance
>>> scale) but fixed it again (replaced resistor).
>>> Many other test equipment I designed and build, like amplifiers LF and
>>> RF, SWR meter, radiation meters, gamma spectrometer,
>>> GHz stuff for satelite, transmitters low and very high power, what not,
>>> a frequency converter to use the RTL-SDR sticks and so the spectrum
>>> analyzer on higher and lower frequencies.
>>> Have a SARK100 SWR analyzer too.
>>> Things last forever here...
>>> Scope used on a regular basis..
>>> RTL-SDR stick 24/7.
>>> Digital meters used every day.
>>> Use my self designed lab power supply every day..
>>> What more do you need?
>>> Learn to use the stuff, understand what's important, and that is it
>>> When I started in electronics as a kid I did not even _have_ a meter, still stuff worked.
>>> Build my own scope at some point back then when I somehow got the parts
>>> Not much pocket mony as a kid.
>>> UNDERSTAND your systems, what electrons do.
>>> Showing of with boat anchors may impress people, especially the clueless...
>>> But it does not help you one bit.
>>> Anything with an accuracy better than 1 percent in most cases is just
>>> like apes screaming load trying to impress other apes.
>>> 
>> 
>> Very true about specifically the 1% statement. Sidebar, at an earlier 
>> employment, we needed to equip a new lab. Guys wanted GHz scopes. When 
>> asked if the ever looked at edges faster than 1ns, no one did.
>> 
>> 
>
>It’s true that there are a lot of relatively undemanding jobs in
>electronics. You can get on fine with a 200-MHz scope if all you’re doing
>is PIC and Pi and ham radio and analog TV.   

Bull,
I have been using my Trio 10 MHz dual channel for digital TV too
see
 https://panteltje.nl/panteltje/raspberry_pi_dvb-s_transmitter/
GHz output..

Its is about UNDERSTANDING the systems
You cannot repair a TV set in a short time if you do not UNDERSTAND every part of the circuit and its function, the whole system
neither with a 10 MHz or with a 10 GHz scope.
Fault finding had been my job most of the time, sometimes with 'the show must go on'
or rocket must launch or whatever.

In an environment a million times more complex than your back-room with boat anchors.
And always delivered.. unlike some that dropped out or broke down.
It is indeed about what is between the ears as you mentioned.




>It’s also true that you can often make do with what you have—the most
>important test instrument is the one between your ears. 
>
>In the before times, doctors were much better with stethoscopes than they
>are now.  
>
>But I’d sure prefer a cardiologist who could use tomography and ultrasound
>over the best stethoscope guy. 

Only useful if you can read the screens, these days they train AI to find cancer in the scans.....
Yes I worked in an Uni hospital too.
How many people die each year because of medical errors?
 https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/22/medical-errors-third-leading-cause-of-death-in-america.html
Remember Jim Thompson stating 'they are giving me ... but I had a warning I was not supposed to get that'
Few days later he was dead.


>And it’s a lot easier finding gigahertz oscillations if you aren’t limited
>to a 10-MHz 
>scope with scale marks in cuneiform. 

Giggle Hertz oscillations are not happening in LC circuits of specific kind
where those can happen you can figure from the parts used, no giggle Hz in a BC109.
look at the components used.
I worked on a missile launch system once that did strange things that were tracked down to an oscillating emitter follower...
Replacing that transistor by exactly the same part fixed it.. not one transistor is the same it seems, especially from different manufacturers..
but those were not very high frequency oscillations and I had a faster scope there.
In broadcast I ran around with a big Tec on a cart all day...
A TV studio complex and control is something vastly bigger than your back room.
 https://www.mediapark.nl/
and every second counts
Yes without in depth knowledge of all that stuff you would not even know where to start .
And THAT in depth knowledge is the key.


>Good boat anchors make capability like that very affordable. My lab is full
>of top-of-the-line gear (over $2M at list price), for which I’ve paid about
>2-3 cents on the dollar. (Not counting a few very helpful donations early
>on.)  Of course I have some good newer stuff, such as a two-channel arb, a
>NanoVNA2, and a logic analyzer with protocol decoding. 
>
>It’s a bit old-school-looking, so it doesn’t impress visitors unless they
>actually know something, and that suits me perfectly well. 
>
>But by all means don’t buy any, so it’ll keep being cheap for me. ;)

I won't, if I specifically want to KNOW some thing I build something for that purpose,
I better not ask if you per accident contributed to that F35 crap.
Anyways, carry on, makes me feel safer...


>Cheers 

Do not drink when doing 'tronics