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Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: zen cycle <funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech Subject: Re: bike light optics Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2024 12:25:03 -0400 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 108 Message-ID: <uuuhcv$217ni$1@dont-email.me> References: <uuk938$3icl$1@dont-email.me> <uukbbn$42v9$3@dont-email.me> <uukcfb$3tspr$1@dont-email.me> <jrjPN.617728$Rq2.250265@fx15.ams4> <uumsuu$qiga$3@dont-email.me> <zyDPN.635506$Rq2.626274@fx15.ams4> <uun21g$rv7k$1@dont-email.me> <rxGPN.525218$jO2.46696@fx10.ams4> <uunli6$13usc$1@dont-email.me> <FPPPN.269588$Tp2.235755@fx03.ams4> <uup543$1esl6$1@dont-email.me> <uupacr$1g40b$2@dont-email.me> <gdc01jt1kv6du02fpdcgla46gqi2p0m7i2@4ax.com> <uupe8p$1h30i$1@dont-email.me> <ssg11j51k1a6f5kk3enka6ivqr8lpc3sgs@4ax.com> <uurf3j$22sur$1@dont-email.me> <uurqdl$25ehk$2@dont-email.me> <uus12i$274o6$1@dont-email.me> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2024 16:25:06 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="0d6f67dba8bc108c8520dae092b29930"; logging-data="2137842"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+OiByI0xfXeti9Nsaxcjc+Ou8OV8sLfOM=" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:UVOL0oSe+TL7RPimecA8Lq3Gx/o= Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <uus12i$274o6$1@dont-email.me> Bytes: 6153 On 4/6/2024 1:34 PM, AMuzi wrote: > On 4/6/2024 10:40 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote: >> On 4/6/2024 8:27 AM, AMuzi wrote: >>> On 4/5/2024 10:54 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: >>>> >>>> Well, if taxation is not your cup of tea (or blood), then perhaps we >>>> should finance our government using the traditional methods of >>>> sacking, plundering and pillaging other countries. This has worked >>>> fairly well since history has been recorded (by the winners). If you >>>> want some fairness and logic, successful conquerors usually hire >>>> politicians, philosophers and economists to justify their actions, all >>>> of which are summarily declared to be fair and logical. >>>> >>> >>> The original Constitution had a better ethos IMHO than the >>> incorporation of envy as a guiding principle after the XVI Amendment. >>> Predictably the situation has degraded such that more than half of us >>> pay zip and many of those have a negative Federal tax burden, i.e., >>> they are paid to be here. So much for 'shared burden'. And also >>> predictably election results reflect the avarice and envy of the >>> takers against the makers, creating societal and cultural divisions >>> to our greater loss. There has to be a better way. And there was. >> >> As usual, I'm interested in how other nations manage things. Which >> leads me to again ask: Is there a nation that finances its operation >> in ways you like? >> >> I'm aware that much of Europe has economic structures that generate >> far less economic disparity. Taxes are higher, but tax-generated >> benefits are also far higher, and citizens are generally much more >> content. It's not that there are zero problems, but that there seem to >> be far fewer problems than we have. >> >> Also, when making comparisons, it seems simplistic to say "The U.S. >> did things better in 1795" or whenever. Conditions were totally >> different then regarding society, technology, morality, customs, >> personal freedom etc. Anyone who campaigned for election saying "Let's >> just go back to all the laws we had in 1795" would surely lose the >> vote of almost all women and blacks, and most of while males as well. >> > > Nice straw horse you have there. Maybe I'll help you beat on it later. bullshit. Constitutional originalists - those claiming _such_ things as "original Constitution had a better ethos" come up empty when reminded that racism and misogyny were quite literally written into the original version. Sure, when asked about the 3/5ths compromise they say 'oh, yeah, except for that', then when asked about giving women the right to vote they say 'oh, yeah, except for that'. 'except for that'..... 'except for that'... IOW, they aren't really originalists at all. It's overly simplistic and myoptic to wax for the 'good ole days'. Things change. Get used to it. > > As regards actual economics, and ignoring various other cultural > failings you mention, no nation in history enjoyed so large a wealth > increase and so fast and so broadly shared as the USA between 1865 and > 1914. which also lead to labor riots and such "laudable" MAGA type events like the the homestead riots and the triangle shirtwaist fire.... 'except for that'.... 'except for that'..... so much for originalism. > > Regarding 'income disparity', the myth seems to have shouted over the > actual data: > > https://www.hoover.org/news/senator-phil-gramm-john-early-dispel-myths-income-inequality-america > > But it serves some interests to perpetuate that lie, and so 'official > numbers' utterly ignore public transfers (rent, food, medical, walking > around money, negative income tax and so on) which are no longer > negligible. They are in fact a huge drain on our society. Economists > have noted this for years but in politics facts do not matter. Yup, abolish minimum wage, get rid of that pesky OSHA, fuck the 40 hour work week, let's put children back to work in mines...they're smaller and can fit into tighter crevices - but hey, Carnegie built a few libraries, so I guess that makes chaining children to looms for 2 cents a day makes it all worth while. 'well, except for that...' 'except for that'..... You can whine about fucking strawmen all you want, but excesses by oligarchs are prevalent even to this day. https://perfectunion.us/how-the-sacklers-got-and-stayed-rich/ Gee, maybe if they just built a few parks we could ignore their greed murdered millions.