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From: Andrew <andrew@spam.net>
Newsgroups: misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: Re: To adults - very few on this newsgroup - like badgolferman - what do you think of the facts?
Date: Mon, 20 May 2024 14:42:55 -0000 (UTC)
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Chris wrote on Mon, 20 May 2024 09:43:04 -0000 (UTC) :

> Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:
>> Chris wrote on Wed, 15 May 2024 17:12:35 -0000 (UTC) :
>> 
>>>> <https://www.androidheadlines.com/2022/01/google-monthly-changelog-play-system-updates.html>
>>>> "Google System updates, meanwhile, are fully automated. Originally
>>>> referred to as Project Mainline, these updates fix bugs discovered 
>>>> in various OS components like device connectivity, location services,
>>>> media services, Emergency alerts, and others."
>>> 
>>> But does it patch every exploit in android which is what you claim Apple
>>> does do? Having lots of updates on *some* things is pointless. 
>> 
>> Chris,
> 
> Answer the question. 

I responded to every one of your questions, Chris (see below), as if
you own the same adult capacity to comprehend details as I do, Chris.

In addition, after I spent a while documenting the answers for you,
Chris - which I expect you to read and understand every cite below 
before responding, I posed a question for you in the last line of 
this missive. *Please see the last line for a question for you.*

Just as Microsoft doesn't patch Firefox bugs, Android has a system for 
updating all the apps (it's part of the Google Play Store setup, Chris).

Just as Microsoft has a monthly Patch Tuesday, Android has a monthly patch 
of every single Android device on the Internet (older than version 4.4).

And for platform specific bugs, Samsung and Google have full support for 
seven years now - which includes all operating system updates during that 
time frame (it could be as many as seven major releases, Chris).

Do you understand any of that, Chris?

>>> Many apps also won't be updated if they're on old versions of android. So
>>> again partially patching android 4.4 is pointless. 
>> 
>> What you do not understand is the non-Google apps are updated separately.
> 
> I absolutely know that, which is exactly the point. Non- google apps refuse
> to update their apps on obsolete versions of android. So Google supposedly
> updating some parts of Android 4.4 is a waste of time. 

Again, I will speak with you as if you're an adult, Chris.
Even though this has been explained on this group umpteen times already.

All non-Google apps are updated by their developers, Chris. 
Just like non-Apple apps are updated by their developers, Chris.

The non-Google apps are automatically updated, by default, on Android, by 
the Google Play Store update mechanism. Since I use a clone of the Google 
Play Store (which doesn't require me to create a login on the phone), my 
Play Store clone also updates all the non-Google apps automatically.

This is one update mechanism that is exactly the same on *all* common 
consumer operating systems, Chris. I'm sure even iOS & macOS do that.

>>>> That's way more updates than Apple gives you Chris.
>>> 
>>> I thought more was bad? Every time there's an ios update, you rave on how
>>> bad apple is at testing things. So android updates = good and apple updates
>>> = bad. Got it![1]
>> 
> 
> Answer the question. Is the frequency of android updates a good thing?

Yet again, I will answer assuming you own adult comprehensive skills.
Even though this has been explained on this group umpteen times already.

What matters is that Apple devices always have more known exploits than 
Android and that iPhones always have twice as many zero-day holes, Chris.

What also matters is Apple updates iOS as an "almost monolith", where only 
in iOS 16 did Apple begin to start the process of modernizing updates.

Until iOS 16, if a single line of code changed in iOS, Apple had to build 
an entire new release stream - which - of course - is an idiotic way of 
sending out hotfixes.

Only in iOS 16 did Apple begin to learn how to use modern systems of 
patching such that an entire release didn't have to be built if only a 
single line of code had to be patched.

I'm sure you know none of this, Chris, yet we've discussed this on this 
newsgroup since RSR mechanisms were first advertised back in iOS 15 days.
<https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201224>

>> There's a reason I call you religious zealots ignorant, Chris.
>> 
>> a) You show zero evidence you read the cites that badgolferman did
>> b) Worse, you show zero evidence that you understood them.
> 
> I have shown you the evidence several times. The fact you chose to snip it
> rather address it, speaks volumes regarding your wilful ignorance. 

Chris, 

This is why I call you Apple religious zealots what I call you.

I answered all your questions so many times that I can't even count how 
many times I've explained on this very newsgroup how Apple is the only 
common consumer operating system vendor who does things this strange way, 
and as a result, iOS is exploited far more than Android is exploited.
 <https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog> 

There's a reason I dumb answers down most of the time for you Apple zealots
as it doesn't matter how many times I explain how iOS and Android update 
differently, you are too ignorant and uneducated to comprehend anything.

Notice badgolferman even took fifty times to understand it, given we've 
discussed this topic at least fifty times on this newsgroup, Chris.

But he at least understood it in the end as shown in this very thread that 
he read the cites which show Apple has never fully supported more than one 
release at any given time - which only Apple does. Nobody else does that.

> The evidence is two-fold: 1) Apple updates older versions of ios very
> regularly, 2) ios support of older hardware is *years* longer than Google
> or Samsung. Their new policies will only come into reality i'm a few years.

Read the references, Chris. These are facts. Not trolls.
 <https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog> 
 <https://screenrant.com/apple-product-security-update-lifespan/>
 <https://support.apple.com/guide/deployment/about-software-updates-depc4c80847a/>
 <https://hothardware.com/news/apple-admits-only-fully-patches-security-flaws-in-latest-os-releases>
 <https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/10/apple-clarifies-security-update-policy-only-the-latest-oses-are-fully-patched/>
 <https://www.cnet.com/tech/mobile/samsung-extends-android-and-security-updates-to-7-years/>
 <https://www.tomsguide.com/opinion/google-pixel-8-software-updates>
 <https://www.androidheadlines.com/2022/01/google-monthly-changelog-play-system-updates.html>

You live in the past. That last thing you heard about Apple was from Jobs.

>>>> The fact is Apple only fully supports one release only.
>>>> No other operating system vendor has support that sucks that bad.
>>> 
>>> It's an acceptable model when all supported hardware can run the most OS.
>>> You wouldn't expect anyone to keep a 386 up-to-date? Maybe you would. 
>> 
> 
> Answer the question!

One more time I'm going to respond to you as if you're an adult.
That means you need to read and undersand the response, Chris.

If you can't do that, you don't own adult comprehensive skills, Chris.
Especially for someone who claims to have a PhD in the life sciences.

My Windows desktop was built in 2009 and it's still running a fully 
supported operating system that has all known bugs patched, Chris.

My non-Microsoft apps and drivers are fully patched too, since I have 
programs that handle the patching for me, Chris, such as UCheck, 
VulnDetect, PatchMyPC, WingetUI, UpdateHub, Chocolatey & Scoop
(in addition to Sumo/Dumo which were deprecated late last year).

Looking at my updaters on Windows, here they are in alphabetical order... 
 C:\> cd C:\software\updaters\.
 C:\> mkdir {chocolatey,patchmypc,scoop,ucheck,updatehub,vulndetect,wingetui}

 *chocolatey* v2.2.2
 "Chocolatey is the package manager for Windows (like apt-get for Windows)"
 <https://chocolatey.org/products/#foss>
 <https://chocolatey.org/install>
 <https://community.chocolatey.org/>
 <https://community.chocolatey.org/packages>
 <https://community.chocolatey.org/packages/chocolatey>
 <https://packages.chocolatey.org/chocolatey.2.2.2.nupkg>
 Name: chocolatey.2.2.2.nupkg
 Size: 5243268 bytes (5120 KiB)
 SHA256: 4E1ACBDAC571719F90B2566566668C448A20074E7C2E3FAA37251C62AF4EFD86

 *patchmypc* 
 "Simplify third-party patching on your home PC"
 <https://patchmypc.com/home-updater#download>
 <https://patchmypc.com/freeupdater/PatchMyPC.exe>
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